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submitted 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) by rainynight65@feddit.de to c/australia@aussie.zone

"Peter Dutton has called a press conference for 10am, so it is all official – nuclear is go.

The Coalition teleconference meeting has wrapped up, and the seven sites have been named and it is as we thought: Collie in Western Australia, Mt Piper and Liddell in New South Wales, Callide and Tarong in Queensland, Northern Energy in South Australia and Loy Yang in Victoria."

"There are already issues being identified with the sites – first, the sites would need to be purchased from private operators. There will need to be some pretty major changes to legislation, both state and federally. The Queensland LNP, as recently as yesterday, said it would not lift the nuclear ban for the state, which is a problem given two Queensland reactor sites have been identified by Dutton’s team.

Tarong in Queensland is a particular issue as it doesn’t have a secure water source. In 2006, then-premier Peter Beattie had to propose a waste water pipeline as a last ditch measure to save the plant during a drought."

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[-] spartanatreyu@programming.dev 9 points 4 months ago

Nitpick: Nuclear isn't obsolete, it's as modern as the design you choose.

Nuclear isn't a replacement for renewables (like the coalition tries to suggest), and it isn't evil (like an internal faction in the greens tries to suggest).

We need:

  • Renewables: for the best power production we can produce (when available)
  • Energy Storage: to store excess renewable power for when it's not available
  • Nuclear: to maintain baseline power (as opposed to peak power) for emergency scenarios.

Sidenote: Since whenever anyone suggests that nuclear isn't to be abhorred whenever it's brought up, here are the 3 common things brought up so no one has to ask it.

  1. Risk of meltdowns
  • Modern designs are meltdown-proof with passive safety built in (as opposed to active safety where you need to keep providing power to keep things safe like Fukushima). You can fly a plane into a modern nuclear reactor and the reaction just stops.
  1. Nuclear proliferation
  • We have our own large amount of uranium on the continent. We don't need to encourage others to mine and sell it, and we don't need to sell it overseas ourselves.
  1. Nuclear waste
  • It's common practice today to simply recycle nuclear waste as nuclear fuel. That way you get many more uses out of with less overall fuel that needs to be produced. By the end of it you have a kind of nuclear waste concentrate that burns itself out much quicker (meaning you only need to store it for about 100 years as opposed to 1000s of years). Also, that concentrate itself can be used in things like betavoltaics (think weak but long lasting batteries in things were you don't want to have to replace the batteries, e.g. pacemakers, smoke detectors, scientific sensors, etc...)
[-] rainynight65@feddit.de 7 points 4 months ago
[-] spartanatreyu@programming.dev 1 points 4 months ago

That source doesn't have a link to their paper that works.

But based on what was stated just in your link, they say if we build enough storage then we wouldn't need any baseload generation, which is technically correct.

In particular, they're relying on hydro and gas storage.

(specifically renewable gas and not natural gas, because natural gas is still bad)

But as far as I know we can't build anywhere near enough hydro in Australia. Gas storage could technically work, but you'd have to build a ludicrous and economically infeasible amount of gas storage, or pump it into empty spaces underground (but I don't think we have enough of those in Australia either).

I'm under the impression that modern nuclear plants as baseload production would still be cheaper than the renewable gas storage we would need to maintain power.

Do you have a working link to the original paper or a study into how much renewable gas storage we'd require and the costs associated with it?

[-] Mountaineer@aussie.zone 5 points 4 months ago

That source doesn’t have a link to their paper that works.

Yeah, link rot.
I did some googling for you: https://www.ceem.unsw.edu.au/sites/default/files/documents/Low%20Emission%20Fossil%20Scenarios.pdf

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this post was submitted on 18 Jun 2024
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