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Why do cell phones have a data limit but home internet doesn't? I understand bandwidth limits, but how can home internet get away with giving users all the data they can use, but cell phone providers can't?

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[-] HelixDab2@lemm.ee 13 points 1 day ago

Lots of home internet does have a data cap, but you might not realize it. Typically what will happen is that, once you hit your cap, you'll be rate throttled. That throttle might not affect most video streaming since Netflix is really good at video compression, but you'll see the hit if you are, for instance, downloading large games from PSN, Steam, etc.

[-] Thteven@lemmy.world 17 points 1 day ago

I went over my home data cap a couple times. The ISP rep was not amused when I called to have them bump my speed down to the lowest tier and add unlimited data. I pay less now and the speed difference is not noticeable for me with daily usage. I told them I was going to download random crap all day, delete, and redownload out of spite lol.

[-] eldavi@lemmy.ml 20 points 1 day ago

money.

data caps are coming to home internet soon too and with inescapable hidden contracts; switch to an independent isp to avoid it before you're entrapped into one.

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[-] Bishma@discuss.tchncs.de 14 points 1 day ago
[-] bstix@feddit.dk 9 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

If my phone didn't have a cap, I'd hotspot it all, which is basically the idea of cellular home internet routers. I found a home router without a cap, which time will tell to be true, but it's still more expensive than my phone with a very large but not unlimited cap.

They want to get paid, that's the reasoning. The amount of data is really irrelevant except for pricing.

Roaming fees used to be the same until EU stepped in. Hopefully EU will eventually step in and order a full stop to ALL CAPS too. We live in the "future" now, right? Bring me my free unlimited connection so I can download that car they talked about.

[-] teuto@lemmy.teuto.icu 7 points 1 day ago

I have the opposite. Unlimited phone data, but it throttles above some high number that I've never hit. Capped home internet from crapcast, 1.3 TB, I haven't hit it but I've come within a couple gigabytes.

They offer unlimited data if I use their modem/router for an extra $10/mo. Of course their modem comes with the wonderful feature of a public hotspot for any other Comcast customers in the area. I've been thinking about getting their modem, putting it in a metal box and just using pass through with my opnsense box.

[-] Robin@lemmy.world 7 points 1 day ago

Playing devil's advocate here. A possibly legitimate reason ISPs put in data caps is wireless spectrum congestion.

[-] r00ty@kbin.life 9 points 1 day ago

It's going to be precisely the reason. If you have a dedicated wire, fibre or copper then the entire available bandwidth is available per connection (one caveat with copper is crosstalk but it is minimal and can be mitigated). With fibre the available bandwidth per strand is huge.

It's so fast that even where there's contention, it is rarely a problem that everyone sharing a part of the connection is downloading or uploading at once. So pretty much most of the times you test, you get the full speed.

With mobile data, the entire cell is sharing a small amount (in comparison) of spectrum. Unlike a wire, the entire spectrum cannot be used by a single tower, a pretty small number of channels are carved out for them. Also because the signals are travelling through the air, there is more of a problem of signal loss and interference to contend with, so the channels very rarely reach the maximum possible speed (forward error correction and reducing bits per symbol to reach a suitable signal to noise ratio both will reduce speed for example.

For upload (which isn't usually much of an issue) there's another problem of guard time between timeslots. When downloading, the cell transmitter transmits the whole time and shared the channel between all users (another thing that can slow things down) so there's no problem of needing a guard time. But when it's separate transmitters (phones) sending there's going to be a guard time between different handsets timeslot and the more active transmit stations there are (phones) the more these guard times add up to wasted bandwidth. Luckily most people are downloading far more than uploading, so it's less of an issue.

I think for these reasons caps are used to limit people from ALWAYS consuming data on the cell/mobile networks and instead using wifi wherever they can in order to keep it fast for those that do/need to.

[-] TranquilTurbulence@lemmy.zip 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 11 hours ago)

Playing devil’s accountant here. A possibly legitimate reason ISPs put in data caps are shareholder dividends and capital appreciation.

  1. Charge more
  2. Provide inferior service
  3. Profit

It's a self managed QOS. If the customer knows they can only use X data they're going to be a bit more cautious about using it. Vs if they have unlimited data then they'll just download that 50 gig file on their phone because "fuck it why not". The less data each individual customer uses the less infrastructure they have to build, and the faster/more consistent their existing stuff will be.

Cell tower time is a LOT more expensive than time on a fiber optic cable. Your ISP installs a few boxes to serve your neighborhood, a cell carriers tower might go 20 miles.

[-] kmartburrito@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago

My Comcast has a terabyte monthly data cap. They will send you an email if you get close to it, and if memory serves they allow you one time to go over it before they charge you some.

Even with downloading many big games sometimes when I refresh my PC and using streaming video apps all the time, I've never hit it but have come close several times. I also work from home.

[-] Nougat@fedia.io 5 points 1 day ago

AOL used to be $19.95/mo for forty hours, then an additional charge per minute beyond that.

[-] CaptDust@sh.itjust.works 3 points 1 day ago

Oh god, taking me back to their stupid always-on-top timer on the screen. It was anxiety inducing. I'm so glad pay by the minute internet didn't last, can you imagine??

[-] Nougat@fedia.io 3 points 1 day ago

I can. My phone bills were over $400 for a while in the early 90s. $400 in 1994 is worth over $850 today.

[-] schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de 4 points 1 day ago

Neither of those statements is universally true. It is a tendency, but not a universal rule.

Mobile internet is newer, less essential to many people, and I think mostly more costly to operate for the ISP per amount of data transferred, so this is why it tends to be the case. But there are unlimited mobile plans and limited home plans too in the world.

[-] brap@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago

I guess it depends what country you're in. I don't have limits on either and don't want to imagine having that concern.

[-] TranquilTurbulence@lemmy.zip 3 points 1 day ago

The first time I saw a mobile plan without any limits was somewhere around 2003-2004. Pretty soon after that, all the competitors started offering similar plans. So glad we got rid of those stupid limits.

[-] card797@champserver.net 3 points 1 day ago

I am lucky to have a local ISP that is amazing. I'm hoping that they never change.

[-] bluGill@fedia.io 3 points 1 day ago

It is a proxy for don't use too much on the busy towers. In small towns it doesn't matter, but if you are in a downtown the tower will have many people connecting to it and the radio frequencies are shared. By putting a limit on everyone they force better sharing of that limited bandwidth. The limit is very large - far more that than the large abusers will use alone, but in a dense areas it is less than the common person will use all at once.

Tmoblie has (or had?) a binge on plan - if you used video (which we quickly figured out meant low quality - but probably good enough for a tiny phone screen) or audio you were using a lot of data, but it was consistent all day and so they didn't have to count it - if the tower doesn't have enough bandwidth for everyone on the first day of the month they have to fix that. That is the real worry: the tower running out of bandwidth on the first day of the month.

[-] GGNZ@lemmy.nz 2 points 1 day ago

It depends where you live, Here pay $45usd for unlimited 1Gb/500Mbps Fibre and it is truly unlimited (usually 15-20Tb a month) and  $35usd for unlimited 5G tho it's throttled abit after 60Gb.

[-] hperrin@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago

Home internet usually does, it’s just pretty high.

[-] nimpnin@sopuli.xyz 2 points 1 day ago

Neither my phone internet nor my home internet has a GB limit. The phone internet costs 25€ a month, and home internet 30€.

[-] DarkThoughts@fedia.io 2 points 1 day ago

Home internet had data limits too. In fact, you originally paid by the minute of usage through your telephone line before flat rates became a thing, blocking all calls in the process. Back in the day we'd use various time limited free trials by AOL and other ISPs to browse (Freenet was a very big one here in Germany), which they kinda threw out battling each other for customers. Look up AOL free trial CDs for example.

[-] Steve@communick.news 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

They convinced the FCC, cellular networks are different than wired, and should have different rules.

[-] CaptDust@sh.itjust.works 2 points 1 day ago

My previous home line had a hard cap at 1TB per month. That seemed like a lot at the time, but I think as the internet grows and requires more bandwidth these "sky high" caps will feel smaller and smaller.

[-] spankmonkey@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago

Limits on home service used to be more common, but some plans still have caps. My home internet has a cap, it is just really, really high and they charge you more for exceeding it instead of cutting off access.

My phone also has a cap, but the cap means the connection is throttled instead of charging more.

I have had a home plan in the past woth no limit, but they didn't offer service to my new house when I moved.

[-] ohellidk@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 day ago

greed. some home internet services are also capped too for the exact same reason.

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this post was submitted on 24 Oct 2024
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