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this post was submitted on 17 Aug 2023
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I know you're running hot after that one, but - didn't you mean "we reject ... ends ~~never~~ justify the means"?
Wait no, I just read back the thread again. You're saying that Sherman's march was justified, because it was pivotal in ending the Civil War with a Union win, and by extension, ending slavery in the US.
No. Sherman's march was not justified. It was horrible and cruel. When he decided to do it, and continue it, he lacked the hindsight that we enjoy. He could make some shorter term predictions, but nothing like being certain that it was necessary to end the war.
"But if it hadn't happened, or had failed, then the war may have turned out another way." That's an absurd thought experiment, because it didn't happen any other way. There is no "if."
The march happened, it was bad, historians now (with the benefit of hindsight) can point to the effects it did have (and historians don't always agree on everything or have complete and accurate information), the North won, slavery ended, which was good.
If the future ends justify the present means, that is license for anyone to do anything, with a clear conscience. And you never ever have to get to the stated end, even if it is your sincere belief, and even if your belief is in an empirically good thing.
We can soundly dismiss you based on the tone policing alone. Bye
That first part, before "Wait no," was the entirety of my initial comment. I was trying to be kind with what I thought was a correction.
And then I realized you actually meant that - that the ends justify the means. Which I firmly and wholly disagree with, for the reasons I explained above.
You are arguing with someone who by all outward appearances is psychotic.
I'm not even really arguing, per se. But when someone is so wrong about something as critically important as the concept of "ends justifying means," I cannot let it stand without prompt and thorough comment. It is my civic duty to reply, if not for the person I am replying to, then for the passers-by who may be reading.
Totally fair.