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this post was submitted on 10 Jun 2025
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EDIT: Kidnapping. The word you're ignoring in the title is kidnapping.
They put it in quotes.
Funny how they are careful with words when they were literally on international water.
I feel like indie news is more important than ever, even if it means hand-cranked mimeos and passing them from person to person. Telecom can be cut at any time.
It's not kidnapping if Israel does it apparently 🤨
When the UN doesn’t stop the Israeli’s from declaring it a conflict zone. It’s technically not kidnapping. Just like how the US abducted people in Iraq and Afghanistan.
No. They never entered anywhere Israel is legally allowed to exclude even in war It being full of aid and verifiable non combatants.
It's kidnapping.
Your example is also kidnapping but even excluding that bit of nuance the key word is "in" they never entered territorial waters and thus were never "in" Israel or Palestine. Israel can declare 1500mi of the coast of Somalia an exclusion zone then kidnap people there and that would make just as much sense in a legal view.
Doesn’t Israel delegate 200 miles off the coast as a no go zone?
Illegally
Something like that but the important thing is Israel is not claiming they entered the exclusion zone and similarly they even if they did the result is supposed to be being forcibly turned away not kidnapping and property theft.
Gaza is under a declared blockade, Maritime Law (the oldest of international law) allows detaining any ship bound for a blockaded port. It's really cut and dry, they very publicly declared they were bound for a blockaded port. It's not like Israel boarded a ship that just happened to be in the area, these freedom flotilla yahoos very publicly declared they were bound for Gaza, which under Maritime Law permits Israel to board it.
International law is an agreement between nations and doesn't actually restrict nations from doing things that will hurt your feelings. You're going down the sovcit path when you pretend international law is whatever you want it to be.
That's exactly what happened, blockade borders have to be announced and ships have to be allowed time to leave the area. Israel left their blockade and kidnapped people aboard a ship they did not allow to leave an area they weren't in.
Once they breach the blockade yes arguably though with only aid that gets more complex. Essentially aid entry is allowed so long as you agree to security arrangements that are both reasonable and lawful. That could mean Israel could board and search, or doesn't mean they can blockade all aid to starve a population which is specifically and in multiple very very illegal.
https://casebook.icrc.org/a_to_z/glossary/blockade
Their sources section is awash with good relevant information and specifically findings on the last Israeli famous Israeli blockade and subsequent boarding (and death of iirc 9) which was found to be a legal blockade so long as the purpose was not starvation and aid could enter with security arrangements.
So... according to the link you've provided Israel is actually required to board the ship or they can no longer prevent shipments of weapons coming from Iran?
Has there been any indication these flotilla activists attempted to make such security arrangements with Israel?
Correct to an extent, the accepted meaning is that they must agree to security measures to pass through. It is not and never has been a way to willfully prevent aid and aide staff into combat zones.
They weren't in a blockaded zone as far as I'm aware, Israel only says they were approaching and providing intented destination as you must when attempting to pass through a blockade.
Even ignoring that they must be allowed to leave even if they enter the blockaded area without permission, it isn't a seize your property and imprison your crew for being in the general area openly providing intent kinda thing.
Source?
Ew.
Captured or arrested is the word you're actually looking for. Or, as it currently stands, released.
Y'all are delusional trying to make 'kidnapping" a thing 🤣
What would you call intercepting someone in international waters and taking them back to your country without their consent? If Somali pirates did that you'd have no qualms using the word 'kidnapped'.
It's a blockade for a war zone. Standard practice for centuries, unless they just shoot you which was the previous option for most of humanity.
Now let's get pedantic and have someone screech that Israel doesn't recognize Palestine and it's not a war so no blockade 🙄
Israel does not recognise that there are civilian non-combatants in Gaza and therefore does not allow aid to enter. How about you?
The blockade is illegal and israel didn't do it job to allow enough food and aid to enter which is an obligation. They are even shooting people seeking aid
Yeah it's real typical for kidnappings to be publicly known, announced in advance and then the victim safetly returned promptly, entirely unharmed. Im sure you can fram it as a kidnapping with some backflips, but you just look like a whiny child. She was captured and held unlawfully sure, but if it was actually for humanitarian aid and not self publicity, i might have some sympathy.
So if somali pirates would just take the ship and send the crew back home it would all be good?
You're having an interesting opinion here.
I mean, honestly it worked for privateers. Hold up a ship, steal their gold and liquor, leave a month's rations, and sail on. Come to think of it, old school pirates probably had more empathy than Israeli leaders...
Inequivalent.
How so.
you sure act like a whiny child, when faced with some solid arguments.
That's fine
Can't really agree with you on this one. I would welcome and fight for more people doing the right thing for personal benefit. Seems a lot better than the current circumstances.
Doing the right thing for the wrong reasons, in my experience, backfires more often than not. It's a dangerous gamble.
Yes. The only tatoo idea I have for myself involves dice, chains, and the words "Let's tempt Fate." While I would prefer an ideal situation, it's taking too long. I will support any act that brings aid, supplies, or more notoriety to the plight of Gaza. Even Al-Capone had a soup kitchen for the hungry Chicagans of the Great Depression.
If you want this conflict to end the last thing you want to give it is more noteriety. The only reason this is still happening is because of outside influences.
Can you please elaborate on that connection from your perspective. I imagine there must be some context I am overlooking.
Willful ignorance of atrocities does not have any chance of stopping or slowing them. Source: Russian Gulags, North Korea, US native women murders/trafficking, Auschwitz.
All the shouting and "notoriety" just makes it worse. Turns it into a spectacle instead of actually fixing anything. Sometimes, less outside noise is exactly what's needed for people to sort their own mess out. Wayne Dyer said, "Conflict cannot survive without your participation."
Ahh yes, because that solves the bystander effect which is why Kitty Genovese did not die from being stabbed in 1964. Also why the Uvalde police are heros for not participating in that school shooting. /s
You still haven't explained any of your reasoning, so I will assume it is in bad faith.
Finally, your quote is about interpersonal conflict, not violence and murder. Mr. Dyer was a therapist.
You saying "In bad faith" = i cant meaningfully disagree with you
You can prove it's in good faith by explaining your resoning. i.e. How is it worse, specifically? How will they possibly "sort their own mess out"?
If you don't want to, that's fine. Spouting empty platitudes is all I've read the past two responses. Any more will be met with shitposts by me to match your energy.
No, I've lost interest in speaking with you.
Israel does not feel a need to hide their crimes because they believe any action they take is righteous because they are doing it and any action their enemies take is evil because they are doing it
Couldnt you say much the same for the other side?