this post was submitted on 11 Sep 2023
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Comic Strips
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In this instance i kinda agree, but there's a line that gets crossed where that doesn't apply, so perhaps sturdier logic is needed.
EDIT: For instance, if this Ricky Gervais meme were posted to justify a joke making light of police brutality against black people, that's clearly far over the line. This joke isn't even close to the line IMO. But where is the line? And - genuinely, out of curiosity because dark humour is a deep love of mine - what is the correct line of reasoning? I really do think "just take a joke, it's fun, have a laugh" like the meme implies is the correct stance in regards to things like this. But, since the logic doesn't really hold up at the extreme, it to me implies the logic may be a little off.
Things are damaging or they're not. The question of if someone is offended by it is a very seperate thing, and really just a personal choice.
That is a very privileged position to take. They aren't separate issues at all; the fact of someone being offended is inextricably linked to the fact of it being damaging. And to consider it a choice is absurd even on the face of it. Being offended is an emotion. You can't genuinely, fully control your emotions. You can control what you do about it, sure, but not always, and not completely.
And apart from that, even if we entertain the idea of it being a choice - who on Earth would choose to feel offended? It feels awful. And it never goes well. If you even have the guts to say something about it, you generally get mocked and laughed at. Who would choose to go through that?
While I understand your perspective, it's worth noting that reactions to offenses, like many emotions, exist on a spectrum. Some individuals might experience deep hurt from a comment that others brush off with ease. While we can't always control our immediate emotional responses, we can cultivate resilience and perspective over time. Claiming that no one would choose to be offended might oversimplify a complex web of human emotions and social dynamics. Some might lean into being offended as a defense mechanism or to further a personal or societal narrative. Emotions are complex, and so are the reasons behind them.
I believe I addressed this. Of course that's true. That's why I said you can control your actions, "but not always, and not completely".
We can, but certain things are bound to simply be offensive, no matter what. "Perspective" is a buzzword in this conversation. No amount of perspective will get me to react kindly to statements like "women belong in the kitchen". The onus should not lie with the offended party to just not be offended, it should lie with people trying to not be offensive. I don't think that's too much to ask.
No, it really doesn't. Saying people choose their emotions is the oversimplification. Would you "choose" to be angry, sad or scared? No. You can only choose your actions. I think you're conflating emotions with actions.
Being offended doesn't protect you whatsoever. Again, maybe you're conflating actions with emotions. But what actions are you talking about here?
This just seems like a dogwhistle to me. What narrative is furthered by feeling something?
Yes, which is why we should put in more effort than just saying "they're doing it on purpose", and justifying that with a truism. "It's complex" is easy to say. Digging into that complexity is harder, and maybe that's why you're not doing so.
Jesus, I didn't really want to respond to you in another thread but this line I had to say something. Anyone can be offended by anything, so you're saying everyone should go out of their way to not offend anyone? Ok I'm offended by your user name, change it. I'm offended by the way you speak, the onus is on you to change it. I mean a society with that mindset wouldn't function, anything I didn't like I would just say it offends me and demand you change. We need to follow laws, that's why we have them, and we should strive to be good people, but suggesting that a person should try to conform to every little offense anyone could have is unreasonable, that's a VERY slippery slope.
Unless you live in a world where that is normal for decades on end and it becomes your normal. Nazis never saw themselves burning people in ovens, it's not a switch that happens over night. What can become your normal is very scary.
For example saying that you are offended by pride flags because you are homophobic. Maybe you "feel" (general "you", not you specifically) that gay people touch kids, many homophobic people do "feel" that. Feeling that way and expressing your offense to pride flags in that way very much is pushing a homophobic narrative that can be damaging to the gay community.
That's not what defense mechanisms are in psychology. They are subconscious responses, usually to avoid anxiety or facing any cognitive dissonance. If you point out that they hate gay people but are best friends with a gay guy, they may get offended as a way to avoid confronting that cognitive dissonance.