659
About 100,000 turn out in London for pro-Palestine rally
(www.theguardian.com)
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
this post was submitted on 21 Oct 2023
659 points (93.1% liked)
World News
38978 readers
1393 users here now
A community for discussing events around the World
Rules:
-
Rule 1: posts have the following requirements:
- Post news articles only
- Video links are NOT articles and will be removed.
- Title must match the article headline
- Not United States Internal News
- Recent (Past 30 Days)
- Screenshots/links to other social media sites (Twitter/X/Facebook/Youtube/reddit, etc.) are explicitly forbidden, as are link shorteners.
-
Rule 2: Do not copy the entire article into your post. The key points in 1-2 paragraphs is allowed (even encouraged!), but large segments of articles posted in the body will result in the post being removed. If you have to stop and think "Is this fair use?", it probably isn't. Archive links, especially the ones created on link submission, are absolutely allowed but those that avoid paywalls are not.
-
Rule 3: Opinions articles, or Articles based on misinformation/propaganda may be removed. Sources that have a Low or Very Low factual reporting rating or MBFC Credibility Rating may be removed.
-
Rule 4: Posts or comments that are homophobic, transphobic, racist, sexist, anti-religious, or ableist will be removed. “Ironic” prejudice is just prejudiced.
-
Posts and comments must abide by the lemmy.world terms of service UPDATED AS OF 10/19
-
Rule 5: Keep it civil. It's OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It's NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
-
Rule 6: Memes, spam, other low effort posting, reposts, misinformation, advocating violence, off-topic, trolling, offensive, regarding the moderators or meta in content may be removed at any time.
-
Rule 7: We didn't USED to need a rule about how many posts one could make in a day, then someone posted NINETEEN articles in a single day. Not comments, FULL ARTICLES. If you're posting more than say, 10 or so, consider going outside and touching grass. We reserve the right to limit over-posting so a single user does not dominate the front page.
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
Lemmy World Partners
News !news@lemmy.world
Politics !politics@lemmy.world
World Politics !globalpolitics@lemmy.world
Recommendations
For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/
- Consider including the article’s mediabiasfactcheck.com/ link
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
Removed. I'll try to make this as simple to understand as possible... You can't advocate against the genocide of a people by promoting the genocide of another people. I don't care if the argument is "Palestinians need to die so Israel can exist." Or "Israel needs to die so Palestinians can exist." Neither view is acceptable.
Israel is not a people. It’s a genocidal fascist neocolony. Palestine needs to be decolonized. I’m not advocating for the genocide of French people when I’m saying that Algeria needs to be free. The same applies to Palestine.
So how, exact, do you see the process of making Israel not exist proceeding? Genuinely, I'm curious. Do you really see absolutely no way for a state of Israel to exist in some fashion without the genocide of Palestinians? If not, then what exactly are you proposing?
They want them to die, that’s why they just downvote lol
It’s just another emotional moron commenting based on feels as they have zero fucking clue about the actual context, and they have no interest to learn either. Virtue signaling to make themselves feel better I guess
Edit: keep upvoting the comment that literally is calling for the end of Israel as they “don’t have the right to exist” using some shit strawman with Palestinian genocide as a fulcrum as if that’s what Israel is. The is gov does not define the people just like Hamas doesn’t define Palestine. Are you fucking kidding me?
Israel doesn’t have the right to exist? What kind of brain dead shit are you talking about??
Israel absolutely deserves to exist, they were placed there after they themselves were genocided. THAT is the problem, they were placed there and it’s fucked everything.
Israel absolutely deserves to exist just like Palestine.
Jesus fucking Christ, how are you this fucking stupid? Israel’s existence is not dependent on the genocide of Palestinians, that’s just a bullshit strawman you just pulled out of your ass so you could knock it down. Rights are indeed for people but guess what, when people say Israel deserves to exist they’re talking about the Israeli people. Those people deserve to not be killed or ethnically purged from their homes as well, the difference is the Israel never should have been placed there. But guess what they were. So what do the Israeli citizens do? If we ask you, I guess your stance is go fuck themselves because of what the Israeli gov has done over the many years. Do you not see how reductive and fucked that is?
Personally, I have always been a free Palestine supporter and a strong hater of Israeli gov but the mindless emotional backlash like the one in your comment only enables more hate and bullshit. Israel deserves to exist they just don’t deserve to exist on other people’s lands. That’s a big fucking difference to the emotional bullshit you vomited out. When you say “it (Israel) doesn’t (have the right to exist)”, it sounds quite similar to the Hamas goal of the extermination of Israel. Hamas doesn’t represent the Palestinian people, yet here you are with this bullshit. No, I’m not saying if you don’t suck netanyahoo’s dick you’re an antisemite, I’m saying if you seriously can’t see that there are an insane number of innocents on each side of this conflict, then you are lost and unreasonable.
Israel, the Jewish state, doesn't have the right to exist. That doesn't mean the Jews should be pushed into the sea or whatever, but there's absolutely no reason a country that goes "We're the Jewish homeland. Everyone else can eat shit" needs to exist. This is the 21st century, we should oppose the creation of explicit ethnostates.
I think the point is that we saw just two weeks ago the methods that Hamas would use to un-exist Israel, so it's not that hard to read between the lines of what people mean when they say that Israel should not exist.
This isn't really an accurate description of Israel though. Israel isn't the multi-ethnic paradise it should be, but Israeli Arabs have full legal rights and are pretty well-integrated. An Israeli Arab medic was actually murdered at the music festival when he approached Hamas members in an attempt to negotiate with them.
I would agree that Israel should not make full legal rights dependent on being a Jew, but it doesn't do that, even though there are some actions it's taken, particularly under Netanyahu, to tie Israeli identity more strictly to Judaism. That stuff pisses off quite a lot of secular Israelis as well.
And philosophical quibbling about the role of nation states aside, the fact of the matter is that Israel does exist and it's people are not going to go anywhere. Given that Hamas' explicit aim is to murder them all, Israel is going to do anything and everything to resist them. Palestinian statehood cannot and will never proceed if it's dependent on the violent eradication of Israel. Fortunately, it does not need to depend on that, though Israel must do more to facilitate an actual peaceful conclusion, such as dismantling settlements. But regardless, violence is simply not a productive option for the Palestinian cause, and it never will be. It must be abandoned.
It doesn't on paper, but Arabs face discrimination by the government in many aspect of their lives, from education to building permits to how likely they are to get killed by the police (since 1948 the only protestors to get killed by the police have been Arabs).
Didn't they change that part of their charter in 2017? I mean, they've wanted a ceasefire since the very beginning of this mess (and got two in 2008 and 2012 that fell apart due to Israel not following them), but they made it official that they want a 2-state solution in 2017.
The thing is that, seeing the state of the West Bank (and before that how the Oslo accords failed), non-violence is also not working. We all want non-violence to work, but in the past 20 years Israel has given no indication that they're interested in a solution, violent or nonviolent, to the conflict..
The PLO abandoned violence 30 years ago. It didn't work, which is why people flocked to Hamas.
Aha and why does Israel deserve to exist exactly? I couldn’t care less if every single country in the world disappeared tomorrow. Again, rights are for people, not countries and if your statehood relies on genocide and ethnic cleansing, it needs to go. Call me sympathetic to Hamas talking points all you want. I certainly don’t support their ideology but at the end of the day, one person’s terrorist is another person’s freedom fighter and armed struggle against an occupying force is legal under international law. Hamas isn’t even recognized as a terrorist organization by the UN. Hamas could be flowerpower hippies and they’d still be called “terrorists” by Israel and its allies. Really shows how meaningless that word has become.