933
Brexit has completely failed for UK, say clear majority of Britons – poll
(www.theguardian.com)
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
this post was submitted on 31 Dec 2023
933 points (98.0% liked)
World News
39358 readers
1089 users here now
A community for discussing events around the World
Rules:
-
Rule 1: posts have the following requirements:
- Post news articles only
- Video links are NOT articles and will be removed.
- Title must match the article headline
- Not United States Internal News
- Recent (Past 30 Days)
- Screenshots/links to other social media sites (Twitter/X/Facebook/Youtube/reddit, etc.) are explicitly forbidden, as are link shorteners.
-
Rule 2: Do not copy the entire article into your post. The key points in 1-2 paragraphs is allowed (even encouraged!), but large segments of articles posted in the body will result in the post being removed. If you have to stop and think "Is this fair use?", it probably isn't. Archive links, especially the ones created on link submission, are absolutely allowed but those that avoid paywalls are not.
-
Rule 3: Opinions articles, or Articles based on misinformation/propaganda may be removed. Sources that have a Low or Very Low factual reporting rating or MBFC Credibility Rating may be removed.
-
Rule 4: Posts or comments that are homophobic, transphobic, racist, sexist, anti-religious, or ableist will be removed. “Ironic” prejudice is just prejudiced.
-
Posts and comments must abide by the lemmy.world terms of service UPDATED AS OF 10/19
-
Rule 5: Keep it civil. It's OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It's NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
-
Rule 6: Memes, spam, other low effort posting, reposts, misinformation, advocating violence, off-topic, trolling, offensive, regarding the moderators or meta in content may be removed at any time.
-
Rule 7: We didn't USED to need a rule about how many posts one could make in a day, then someone posted NINETEEN articles in a single day. Not comments, FULL ARTICLES. If you're posting more than say, 10 or so, consider going outside and touching grass. We reserve the right to limit over-posting so a single user does not dominate the front page.
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
Lemmy World Partners
News !news@lemmy.world
Politics !politics@lemmy.world
World Politics !globalpolitics@lemmy.world
Recommendations
For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/
- Consider including the article’s mediabiasfactcheck.com/ link
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
Everyone saw this coming but still decided to walk off the cliff rather than admit they'd made a bad decision
"What we believe shapes who we are. Belief can bring us salvation or destruction. But when you believe a lie for too long, the truth doesn't set you free. It tears you apart."
I spent the first twenty years of my life believing that every piece of gum you swallow stays in you forever 🪦
How many pieces of gum would you say you've swallowed over that time?
On average 5 per year, but who's counting
Pootin and the GRU/IRA were behind the effort mostly waged on social media
Yes this analysis was clear as day even before the referendum passed. The only amazing thing here is that 10% still think it has helped. Wow.
10% is actually amazingly low. I've said it before, 25% of any population, any country and time period is dumb as a bag of rocks. So no matter what you'll always have 25% mouthbreathers. Here even 15% of them realized they've been had!
Around 35% of the total population actually voted for it, and even then, those people weren't the ones who decided to push forward despite it clearly being a shit show.
Blame the people responsible, I'm so sick of this lazy "everyone" blanket statements people make about events that have very specific individuals and institutions to blame, all it's doing is literally letting them get away with it.
Mmmmmm no. This is the justification many trump voters used. It implies voters are completely off the hook for the consequences of their actions and it's only the 'scheming criminals' who fooled them that can be held accountable.
Just as ignorance of the law does not get you out of your speeding ticket, allowing yourself to be fooled as a voter doesn't absolve you of the poor choice you made with your vote. It's a collective fuck up. Own it.
The problem with that approach is that just finding a scapegoat doesn’t solve the issue. The Brits and the EU still have to live with the consequences.
The proper way to address this is to analyze what happened and make sure that it will never happen again. If the result of that analysis is that voters are fucking idiots, we somehow have to alleviate that.
You'll never alleviate that. Most people are dumb as fuck. That's not inherently a bad thing, but it can be exploited. In the new age of constant misinformation if you want to get people to vote against their own interests you need only start a gas lighting campaign and without too much effort you'll find success.
Most people aren't dumb, they are just poorly educated and can easily be swayed into making emotional decisions rather than rational ones.
It's also why politicians love non-voters, one less moron you have to convince.
No, it's literally the distraction the likes of Trump use themselves.
It implies that those deliberately using their almost complete power over the legal system, economy, education, and media to manipulate and flat out lie to people, many of who were, also deliberately, made desperate and vulnerable to said manipulation by the very same system in the first place - have nothing to do with the end result. How fucking convenient!
And what exactly am I meant to own? The fact that I voted remain, and did my best to get others to do the same? Are you seriously trying to claim that individuals like myself could ever possibly have more impact than the Murdoch empire? Or David Cameron? Or Boris Johnson? Why the fuck should we own it but not them, when they're the ones making millions if not billions selling lies and doing "talks" about "what they learned" fucking the country up?
Do I begrudge people (again, the literal minority of the population) who voted leave? Fuck yeah. Do I blame them for brexit? Why should I? They didn't think it up, they didn't propose it, they didn't go ahead with it despite warnings because it would further their career and make them money, they didn't lie to and manipulate others to get their way. Those in power did. So I fucking blame them, because they are fucking responsible.
The fact that you compare the voters to criminals, rather than those who manipulated them says it all really.
I bet you also blame cancer patients who die from snake oil they fell for, rather than the grifters who sold it to them..
Those in power don't even need to wash their hands of their actions anymore, people like you literally do it for them. But hey, bootlickers gonna lick boot. Keep blaming powerless individuals for systemic problems, see how that works out for you.. ¯\(ツ)/¯
You get what you vote for.
In this particular case people had no idea what exactly they were voting for.
It was a non binding referendum, they had no reason to give a shit. They still voted for the fuckwits that enforced the non-binding resolution and made it law.
That was clear too, but Conservatives still won a majority and expectedly squashed any chance of a second referendum. We can't absolve ourselves of all blame when democracy is still a functional tool we have at our disposal. Now even democracy itself is under attack all around the world, and I'm afraid that "not my fault" mentality will become a self-fulfilling prophecy.
They did not win a majority.
365 out of 650 seats, 56% majority. It was a record win for them.
Eh only 43% of the vote though. It's just FPTP that cause the majority in the house of commons. It wasn't exactly a binding win for Brexit considering the parties pushing for either remaining or another referendum won more votes overall. Plus a big part of it was a vote against Corbyn, rather than a vote for Brexit.
General elections are too general to be used as justification for a single policy IMO.
I wouldn't say everyone, at least. The vote was actually very close, which I think is something most of us forget at this point.
They used the wrong kind of referendum given the seriousness of the question, it should have required a significant majority consensus, instead it was just a "who got more votes even if it just one more".
The results showed a deeply divided nation, and we still are. Some brexiters do regret their terrible decision, but I don't forgive them. There was ample information, experts, everything showing what a terrible disastrous idea Brexit was, and they voted for it anyway.
This wasn't some shades of grey issue, it was surprisingly black and white for once, haha. Which makes it all the more strange that so many people still voted to deeply damage the nation and their own futures.
Oh, and one other point just because I think we often forget, the referendum wasn't at all binding. The government could have simply said "We've taken your thoughts into consideration but decided to do what's best for the country and stay in the EU, even if this will hurt our political careers. Our duty is to the nation, above even our own careers".
They....did not say that :-( Instead they got theirs, at all our expenses.
Actually only half of all people saw the obvious downsides. The other half said "nuh uh it'll be great, way better in fact" with no evidence or facts and folks went with that.