415
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
this post was submitted on 05 Jan 2024
415 points (95.8% liked)
World News
38529 readers
2038 users here now
A community for discussing events around the World
Rules:
-
Rule 1: posts have the following requirements:
- Post news articles only
- Video links are NOT articles and will be removed.
- Title must match the article headline
- Not United States Internal News
- Recent (Past 30 Days)
- Screenshots/links to other social media sites (Twitter/X/Facebook/Youtube/reddit, etc.) are explicitly forbidden, as are link shorteners.
-
Rule 2: Do not copy the entire article into your post. The key points in 1-2 paragraphs is allowed (even encouraged!), but large segments of articles posted in the body will result in the post being removed. If you have to stop and think "Is this fair use?", it probably isn't. Archive links, especially the ones created on link submission, are absolutely allowed but those that avoid paywalls are not.
-
Rule 3: Opinions articles, or Articles based on misinformation/propaganda may be removed. Sources that have a Low or Very Low factual reporting rating or MBFC Credibility Rating may be removed.
-
Rule 4: Posts or comments that are homophobic, transphobic, racist, sexist, anti-religious, or ableist will be removed. “Ironic” prejudice is just prejudiced.
-
Posts and comments must abide by the lemmy.world terms of service UPDATED AS OF 10/19
-
Rule 5: Keep it civil. It's OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It's NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
-
Rule 6: Memes, spam, other low effort posting, reposts, misinformation, advocating violence, off-topic, trolling, offensive, regarding the moderators or meta in content may be removed at any time.
-
Rule 7: We didn't USED to need a rule about how many posts one could make in a day, then someone posted NINETEEN articles in a single day. Not comments, FULL ARTICLES. If you're posting more than say, 10 or so, consider going outside and touching grass. We reserve the right to limit over-posting so a single user does not dominate the front page.
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
Lemmy World Partners
News !news@lemmy.world
Politics !politics@lemmy.world
World Politics !globalpolitics@lemmy.world
Recommendations
For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/
- Consider including the article’s mediabiasfactcheck.com/ link
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
It says that no matter how horrible an act of war it cannot serve as justification for genocide. Can you detail how that's cringe?
Don't reply to rivermonster. Argues in bad faith and licks IDF boots super hard. Really don't bother. Every Israel thread is filled with his apologism.
I think it's important that people shoot him down using actual facts and reason, then otherwise ignore him. If it keeps just one ambivalent person from believing his lies, it's worth it. Propagandists like him rely on a lack of pushback to spread their lies.
True. It's important to respond not to him but to the people reading his propaganda. Also to educate them on how to refute other IDF propaganda.
It's pretty insane how many full on IDF trolls there are which are clearly not interested in changing their minds. Even Trump didn't have this many trolls to defend him outside of conserve echo chambers.
Oh, you know, I be hatin' I be callin' cringe
TLDR:
Condemns genocide, opening statement then disregards the attack (an act of genocide itself) by a group literally founded to commit genocide that caused the current conflict.
Long answer:
Sure, happy to: opening their genocide case by highlighting a genocidal attack by their allies (Hamas in this case), and then dismissing it. And only focusing on your allies' enemy for your argument that is alledgedly based on principal ; it both undermines the credibility of the failed state of SA and their argument.
This is a country that refused to arrest a criminal wanted for genocide.
Excusing your allies is contrary to arguing principal (in that a principal based argument isn't selective on whether you like Hamas and hate Israel). It's all sorts of super cringe and transparent what they're doing.
Hamas, their buddy, and worldnews' darling were literally founded on committing genocide. Their goal is to destroy Israel. Their foundation is a statement of genocidal intent. Their words.
In the end, it's all academic. The court can't do shit to Israel anymore than the failed state of SA can. ICJ and the ICC are as impotent as all the alt-left kids crying. In reality, this is most likely just propaganda and distraction from SA helping a criminal escape genocide charges.
Omar al-Bashir had warrants out for genocide, and SA refused to arrest him even though as signatories it was mandatory (back in 2015). They were fine with his crimes of genocide, but then again, he wasn't Israeli. LOL, they do NOT care about the principal.
To be fair, pretty much everything about the whole thing is cringe. It's just bait for the stupids and the gullibles.
Though it makes for a good laugh when you look at who the alt-left jumps into bed with.
Never thought I'd ever read someone call South Africa a Hamas ally.
Damn we really need to do something about this South African sharia regime. Gosh darn 1.5% Muslim population having country speaking out against my god ordained right to kill women and children.
Do your history homework. Originally strong ally to the PLO and Arafat and evolved into tight relations with Hamas.
Amazing, you just think genocide is justifiable. That's your cringe.
Can you detail the difference from those historical examples?
No. He cannot.
What's your basis for repeatedly calling SA allies/friends of Hamas?
None other than Bibi's hand up his ass.
Ahhh! So, by your justification, if a group of people were to universally support a terrorist group (which the Palestinians don't), then that's justification to kill every single man, woman, and child in that group. It's justification to ask non-combatants to relocate to so-called "safe"areas, then to bomb those safe areas. By your criteria, every United States citizen is also deserving of death.
All your argument really shows is that you think genocide is acceptable under certain conditions (and that you're a terrible person).
What is the alt left?
Imagine a violent, hateful maga person. Now put them on the left politically and make their focus anti-israel, anti-Jewish, or pro-Hamas. Give them blue Make Hamas Great Again baseball caps, if it helps.
So I have to imagine them? Lol
Yes 😅
Your description is an imaginary person. And your defense is to lash out. I bet you're stable and people like you.
Hey look, a straw man!
I would like to point out that being anti-Israel does not make one anti-Jewish. You can be Israeli and not a Jew and the other way around. That's like saying Russia is anti-Christian because they don't like Americans and the majority of Americans are Christian. But that doesn't make any sense because Christianity is the most widely professed religion in Russia. No-one here is anti-Jewish, just anti-Israel. No need to make stuff up
Agree. Especially pre-october.
But right now, the lines are blured. It's why anti-semtic incidents, attacks, vandalism, etc. have spiked since the terrorists attacked Israel. And rhe most incidents of all occur at the "pro-palestinan rallies", that turn pro-Hamas super easily.
Random selection for ya (pulled from Ground News high factuality sources, uses MBFC and a few others):
https://www.algemeiner.com/2023/11/28/horrifying-germany-registers-29-antisemitic-incidents-per-day-since-hamas-pogrom-in-israel/?utm_source=ground.news&utm_medium=referral
https://www.timesofisrael.com/watchdog-finds-unrwa-workers-praised-hamas-massacres-in-internal-telegram-channel/?utm_source=ground.news&utm_medium=referral
https://abc7chicago.com/hate-crime-chicago-police-department-israel-hamas/14055180/?utm_source=ground.news&utm_medium=referral
I'll preface this with the following: I do not support the atrocities committed by HAMAS and I do not support the atrocities committed by Israel. Both sides are wrong.
The goal of HAMAS is to eliminate Israel. The goal of Israel is to eliminate Palestine.
People in support of Israel argue that Palestinian citizens should be suffering for the government they "elected" (there hasn't been an election there for a while). By their same argument Israelis should be suffering for the governments they actually elected (which have suppressed Palestinians not even treating them as citizens). I don't support either of these views. But my point is any argument that can be made to justify Israel can also be used to justify HAMAS.
I'm all sorts of fine with condem atrocities and war crimes. I hate Bibi and Likud and would love to see the whole lot of them tried. And wewilli be on the same page up to Oct. I'm all for prosecuting collective punishment and other Israeli war crimes pre october. And every rocket fired at civilians was a war crime, and I'm for prosecuting the tens of thousands of those incidents. and other Hamas' greatest hits like suicide bombings and bus bombings.
The Palestinians have rejected 2-state 4 or 5 times, both pre and post. Roughly '37, '47, '67, '00, '08. And Israel has agreed to it multiple times and has been agreeable to it.. Go look it up. It's not hard to find. It's just a more inconvenient fact for Lemmy.
Also, dirty Jerusalem, which NOBODY should get. Since these fucking murderous religious trash of all varieties can't behave. They should just forbid it to everyone. Go kindergarten on them. "Now nobody gets to play with it". Much of the rejection of 2 state is fucking Jerusalem. Religion makes everything horrible.
And Palestinians DID elect Hamas, elected them to destrogy israel and the Jews. And they're more popular than ever. If they held elections today, they'd win easily both in Gaza and West Bank. Abbas is fucked and about to lose power completely.
Hamas is the government there. When people say aid to the Palestinians, what they mean is give money and food and fuel to Hamas (they literally handle it) amd then they also steal it and tell the citizens that Isreal is starving you. It'd great PR both in and outside of Gaza. It works wonders here eith Lemmy radical terrorist supporters and sympathizers.
What does October 7 change? Most 2 state solutions have failed to be fair to Palestinians as the first people there. The only reason why HAMAS is in power is because Israel is oppressing Palestinians and it would make sense that they would hate Israel. Israel was only established fairly recently by kicking the Palestinians out of their land. October 7 was not a terrorist attack, it was an act of war, a war which has been ongoing since Israel was established.
The news sources you linked are Israeli so not worth reading for a balanced perspective
Heh, all Arab states were established fairly recently. LOL.
And holy shit. At least we are done. You're an apologist for terrorists. As I tell a lot of radicalized kids on here who are Hamas aligned or members, you need to self reflect and get out of your bubble.
You're heading down a super dangerous direction that could ruin your life. Take a step back, and take a breath. And step away. When you come back, expose yourself to something other than Hamas propaganda, and the Lemmy echo chamber.
Your assertion that "Oct. 7th wasn't a terrorist attack", is a crazy huge red flag warning. I won't try to reason with you anymore. You're clearly past reason.
I wish you the best of luck and hope you turn away from embracing terroism before you become an active participant.
I've never seen a better recruiting place for Hamas than Lemmy. It's super dangerous, and needs to be addressed.
Frankly, I am insulted by your childishness in response to my arguments