256
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
this post was submitted on 04 May 2024
256 points (93.2% liked)
politics
19127 readers
4584 users here now
Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!
Rules:
- Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.
Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.
Example:
- Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
- Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
- No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
- Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
- No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
That's all the rules!
Civic Links
• Congressional Awards Program
• Library of Congress Legislative Resources
• U.S. House of Representatives
Partnered Communities:
• News
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
What are the elements of the crime of genocide, and how were they all present in Iraq?
Gaza is worse than that abomination because of Israels clear intent to exterminate a people. Which is what makes it genocide. This isn't a war with an unacceptably large amount of deaths - its a targeted extermination campaign that is also engaging in ethnic cleansing and collective punishment
If you can’t see the vilification and indiscriminate killing of Arabs as genocidal, and you’d rather argue semantics, then technically speaking Netanyahu’s horrific actions in Gaza are not genocide until determined by the ICC. Saying “Bush wouldn’t even do this” is absurd.
Genocide is a crime. Crimes have elements. Tell me how Iraq meets all of those elements
Its why Maos great leap forward isn't genocide. Did millions of people die? Yes. Did the CCP intend for those people to die? No. As opposed to the holocaust wherein the deaths of 9 million people were the clear intent.
Here, Netanyahu wants to exterminate the gazans and is doing so. Which makes it genocide
Mens rea/mental intent is a necessary and critical element of all criminal law. It's the distinguishing factor between murder and manslaughter. Or between genocide and neoconservative "nation building". It isn't semantics
It’s determined by the ICC and International law. If you’re being technical of the designation, that’s how it’s defined.
It is determined when the elements of a crime are satisfied.
A murderer has committed murder even if they are never arrested by law enforcement. Shoplifting has still occurred even if the thief is never prosecuted. Israel is committing genocide even if the ICC and ICJ (which are overwhelmingly funded by the United States and the West) never obtain a conviction.
Great, so we can either call killing 35,000 Palestinians and 900,000+ Arabs genocide, or agree it’s not by law. Semantics doesn’t change what happened in 2002, just like it doesn’t change what’s happening in Gaza now. Wrong is wrong, and saying Bush wouldn’t do this is wildly ignorant.
Bush didn't do this. War crimes may have been committed at Guantanamo Bay and Abu Ghraib relating to torture and unlawful treatment of prisoners. And murder certainly occurred via Blackwater's massacres. But no targeted extermination of Iraqis as a group occurred.
During the Iraq War under the George W. Bush administration, there were significant allegations and documented instances of war crimes, particularly concerning the treatment of prisoners and the use of torture. However, the term "genocide" is specific and typically refers to acts committed with the intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial, or religious group. There is no consensus or legal finding that genocide occurred during the Iraq War under these definitions.
Regarding war crimes:
Treatment of Prisoners and Torture The most notorious example was the abuse and torture of detainees at Abu Ghraib prison, which came to light in 2004. Photographs showing U.S. military personnel abusing and humiliating Iraqi prisoners sparked global outrage. Investigations revealed that the abuses included physical and sexual abuse, torture, rape, sodomy, and murder. These acts were violations of the Geneva Conventions, which protect detainees from inhumane treatment.
Legal Consequences: Some soldiers involved in the Abu Ghraib scandal were court-martialed, convicted, and sentenced to varying terms. However, higher-ranking officials and policymakers were largely not held accountable, leading to widespread criticism and allegations of impunity.
The broader context of the Iraq War includes other allegations of war crimes, such as the use of disproportionate force and illegal weapons.
However, genocide has a precise definition.
The crime of genocide is defined under international law by specific elements that must be present for an act to be legally recognized as genocide. These elements are outlined primarily in the Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide (1948) and are further refined in the Rome Statute of the International Criminal Court (1998). Here are the critical elements:
Intent to Destroy: The perpetrator must have intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial, or religious group, as such. This is known as the "special intent" or "dolus specialis".
Protected Groups: The targeted group must be identifiable and protected under the Convention, specifically as a national, ethnical, racial, or religious group.
Prohibited Acts: The Convention specifies the following acts, when committed with intent to destroy a protected group:
The Rome Statute also includes the forcible transfer of a group as an act of genocide when it is intended to destroy the group’s identity.
These elements combine to form the legal framework that courts and international bodies use to determine whether acts constitute genocide, focusing heavily on the perpetrator's intent alongside the nature of the acts committed.