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Trump refuses to say if he wants Ukraine to win the war
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this post was submitted on 11 Sep 2024
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This stood out to me. Do we know of anyone who Trump might be worried about upsetting if he said he wanted Ukraine to win? Anyone at all?
That question is awkwardly worded, why are you putin it that way?
Just not russian to any conclusions
Tsar right to know if he’s compromised.
Moscows are fat. Trump is fat. Coincidence? Probably not.
?
Moscows=most cows
Ah.
Thanks
Fun fact: at his mother's deathbed, Stalin reportedly told her that he had "become something like the Tsar". Perfectly accurate FWIW.
What is confusing to me is why would it matter to Putin if Trump lied here? The Russian mode of government is lying and deception after all.
Does he actually think that his voters want Ukraine to lose? Oh fuck, do his voters actually want Ukraine to lose?
They've been listening to the Russian trolls and bots.
And bought and paid for Tim pool
Their line isn't that Ukraine should lose, it's that America shouldn't give them money while homeless vets, Ukraine is corrupt, biden crime family, nato expansion, etc. Which coincidentally are all Russian talking points.
Those damn russians, constantly bringing up recent history like that.
Didn't Hunter get like millions of dollars from both Russian and Ukranian oligarchs? It's so cool how the kids of politicans always end up with these sweet deals- and to think Trump is claiming to be the deals guy
Oh thanks, I forgot hunter Biden.
Now go and Google what the Budapest memorandum was.
Yes, the CIA psyop'd over 70% of the country to support joining the EU, then forced yanukovitch to say "screw that we love Russia" and piss everyone off. And the totally organic resistance movement in the east that happened to have russian equipment and... Soldiers? Yeah just the people self determining or whatever.
So what about the ethnic Russians, and the rest of the non-Ukranian speakers?
There was a base of people (30% per your post) who didn't support this and when the government cracked down on resistance, city centers ended up shelled with artillery for years.
Just a shitty situation to get caught in the middle of, frankly. Did you support NATO intervention against Serbia when it used its military on a breakaway region?
Funny how those cities still stand after 7 years of shelling. Meanwhile there are several Ukrainian cities that simply don't exist anymore but we'll only see you criticizing Ukraine.
Also I love how you say "government cracked down on resistance" as if that wasn't part of euromaidan first. They cracked down on pro EU protesters first. Then you gesture broadly at the ~30% who didn't support joining the EU or didn't care as if that's some sort of justification for a Russian invasion of Eastern Ukraine. Which happened in 2014. That led to the fighting in those regions that you mentioned.
They still stand and the others do not in part because Russia intervened, the ones that have been under siege recently have all been used as military strongholds for quite some time. They're not civilian centers, the civilians in Donvas didn't exactly have many options.
Did you support Serbia keeping it's territorial integrity against a breakaway region too?
Russia didn't "intervene," they started the fight by annexing Crimea and donbas. There have been 3,400 civilian casualties in the donbas region between 2014 and 2021. There have been 35,000 confirmed Ukrainian civilian casualties between the start of the invasion and July 2024. Remind me how Russia is trying to protect people again? And if this really was just about those regions, why not take them and stop? Why is Russia trying to take kyiv?
Also trying to whatabout about NATO is idiotic. I only referenced the Budapest memorandum. If you want to blame "NATO imperialism" for forcing Russia to invade a soverign country, then I have two questions. Why are there now two more countries in NATO than before the invasion? And do you honestly think NATO would invade a nuclear power? If so, to what end?
It's fine I don't need to engage further with you
Aight later. Before you go, I already had you tagged as "tankie?" Are you like this for China and best Korea too or just Russia so I can update my tag?
I'm an anarchist, but I have plenty of issues with pretty much every country, I just have too many family and family of friends entangled in this to not want to see peace, regardless of where the lines on the map end up for now. I don't think there's anyone who is proposing a truly deescalatory position, across the board and that's the problem.
Half the big right wing youtubers are getting paid by Russia.
Yes. They want Ukraine to lose.
I remember when Russia did go in, briefly Fox News was full of editorializing that Russia should get to have Ukraine. They at least tried to got full on pro-Russia when they thought the narrative might fly and Ukraine was going to just get conquered in a week or so. Clearly they were trying to set things up for blithe acceptance for what Russia had done and for the world to move on (until next time).
I think that between the prolonged conflict and the fact that their boomer audience actually may still be inclined to remember their cold war feelings that this won't fly, that they backed off to less aggressively calling for complete Russian victory. But as seen here, there's still a theme of making it clear that you're ok with whatever outcome, leaning toward "but should we spend our money?" to undermine things rather than calling for a pro-russia outcome outright.
I wonder if a big part of the reason is just the whole phone call about Biden and subsequent impeachment, and how Zelenskyy wouldn’t play ball and the whole thing damaged Trump’s ego in a big way. So even if it’s politically advantageous in every way to say you want Ukraine to win, Trump is incapable of doing so.
The whole reason he tried to keep weapons from Ukraine was because he was given instructions by Putin to make Russia's planned invasion easier.
Trump being Trump, he tried to extort some political favors or of Zelenskyy first, but clearing a path for Putin was always the goal.
Putin's mum.
Yes, I think there's this one man, Trumps big idol, I think his name was Vladimir the war criminal Putin.