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this post was submitted on 13 Sep 2024
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It seems to me like all it's accomplishing is another layer of abstraction rather than a real mechanistic distinction, but I've seen what "bipartisan" action looks like in the US, and the billions in arms given to Israel are a decent start. Republicans and Democrats absolutely have the capacity to collaborate and, when they do, it's monstrous.
Voting at least gives the people a chance to resist the machinations of the bipartisan consensus and get progressives installed.
Voting also brings people like Trump into play. How do you think that will play out with Palestine should he get in again?
Look, it does actually work in Western Europe, the UK, Australia and NZ. All this talk that it can't work is plainly wrong.
What is impossible to get around is American exceptionalism. People just can't conceive that other systems might be better. Fine. I apologise for suggesting otherwise. Enjoy.
Liberals keeps saying that Trump will do genocide x 2, but they have no evidence, nor any indication of how.
Your courts are mostly more professional than America's but I don't find that to be a compelling argument when every country you listed is a reactionary shithole, Australia especially. NZ is the only one that I'd give kind of a pass to there.
You must have missed the bit where Trump constantly says that he's the best friend Israel ever had. I mean constantly.
I'm sure that won't translate to arms supply. Possibly fruit baskets?
Biden is already supplying arms and Harris has vowed to do the same and gone on endlessly about Israel's "right to defend itself" and how anti-genocide protesters are pro terrorism and so on. I'm not saying Trump won't fully support Israel, I'm saying there is no light between that and the Biden-Harris position.
You are free to vote for Trump then. I'm told many are.
When did I ever say I would do that? I am plainly not advocating for such a thing.
Well, I think those is your options? Or not vote at all.
Vote third party, put actual pressure on the Dems to make concessions. If they have your vote no matter what, they have no reason to listen to you.
You might as well vote for Trump and do it clean, because that's all you are helping.
Look, I'm on your side. I've been against US shitty dealings forever. Iraq, Palestine, favoured treatment towards Israel, meddling in elections, overturned democratic governments, proxy wars... All of it. But Trump is an existential threat. If the house is burning down you don't worry about weeds in the fricken garden. If Trump gets in again Palestine is going to turn into a Walmart carpark. It will probably become Israeli territory, officially, and Arab blood will flow accordingly.
It's a shitty choice, but the real world is not like the movies. Voting for a third candidate and making Trump president won't help anyone.
There's no evidence Trump will be worse on Palestine than the Dems. The idea that Trump is worse than any future frontrunner is myopic alarmism, you'll be whipped into a new frenzy just the same with most or perhaps all future candidates (some of whom will be substantially worse). Furthermore, most people live in states where their vote doesn't have any impact on the winner of the election, sothem voting blue only serves to legitimate the popular mandate of the genocidal dems. I don't know, this is all very obvious but it's like my 50th time saying it in this stupid thread.
You say we're on the same side, but your ideology is one of supporting perpetrators into perpetuity because the tautology you've been talked into has no off-ramp, no point in the future where you stop taking "emergency" "temporary" "provisional" "compromises" to "reduce harm" and instead make actual positive progress. There will always be a new election, there will always be a new Republican platform that declares an interest in doing heinous shit, and very frequently there will be more sincere fascists than Trump, like if Tom Cotton ever runs, and there will never be some demon democrat you won't vote for because they are running against someone who is 1% more reactionary, and that thereby necessitates everyone giving them unconditional support.
It's an unserious strategy based on the panicked mindset of people who are stuck in an abusive relationship with liberal media.
Jesus, man, where have you been hiding the last nine years?
This does not read to me as a response
Sorry Feller, you lost me. Enjoy your vote.