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submitted 1 month ago by cerement@slrpnk.net to c/fuck_cars@lemmy.ml
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[-] xapr@lemmy.sdf.org 2 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Let me start by saying that I fully believe in fuck cars and instead having bike lanes and public transportation everywhere.

I alternate between commuting to work by car and bicycle, and I tend to observe other cyclists when I'm driving. What I notice is that a lot of cyclists place themselves in extremely dangerous situations, considering that there are careless drivers on our roads. Running red lights and stop signs is the least of it (I haven't had a need to run red lights, but run stop signs regularly). Most of what I have observed where I live (an urban area) is not cyclists breaking the law to protect themselves, but the opposite: sometimes breaking the law and sometimes obeying the law, both in a way that makes things more dangerous for themselves and for drivers.

Some examples I've seen (more frequently than running stop signs - I very rarely if ever have seen a bicyclist running a red light and would completely understand if they had to do it because of stoplight sensors not detecting them):

Breaking the law (sometimes a combination of several of these):

  • Riding on the sidewalk (arguably improves their safety in some ways, and worsens it in others)
  • Riding the wrong way, against traffic (worsens their safety)
  • Riding the wrong way, against traffic, on the sidewalk (greatly worsens their safety - I almost ran into someone doing this once because I just did not expect someone coming from the wrong direction at high speed in a completely unexpected place when I was turning into a driveway/side street)
  • Riding on crosswalks when pedestrian walking lights are on (worsens their safety)
  • Riding wearing headphones (not sure if illegal - it is for drivers - but worsens their safety)
  • Riding on busy streets not wearing a helmet (not sure if illegal, but worsens their safety)
  • Riding on the street at night with no bike lights (worsens their safety)

Obeying the law:

  • Riding in just about the busiest, fastest street possible, when there's a much safer, parallel, designated "bicycle" street to ride a block away. While this is legal, it makes things more dangerous for themselves and for drivers when they have a perfectly reasonable alternative. I personally go out of my way (literally) to find the least busy streets for my commuting route.

So I guess I'm saying that I'm surprised by the results of this study. I only scanned the actual paper, but one thing that comes to mind is that perhaps some/many cyclists have a greater disconnect between what they think improves their safety vs. what would actually improve their safety?

[-] Isoprenoid@programming.dev 18 points 1 month ago

I tend to observe other cyclists when I’m driving.

So I guess I’m saying that I’m surprised by the results of this study.

That's because you're using anecdotal evidence. If you are looking for cyclists breaking the law, you'll find it because of your inherent bias. This is precisely why studies are needed to back up what we think may be true but aren't sure of. We have to cut away our biases.

[-] xapr@lemmy.sdf.org 2 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Sure, I recognize that what I'm saying is anecdotal, obviously, and I recognize the need for real studies, but it was still surprising that what they seem to be saying in the article (again, I didn't read the paper in detail) doesn't match what I've seen in my city. I can assure you that I see more of the other things I listed than cyclists running stop signs. But maybe you're right and I notice stop sign running less because I do it myself (edit: when I'm cycling, not when I'm driving).

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this post was submitted on 23 Oct 2024
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