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submitted 1 year ago by Stamau123@lemmy.world to c/world@lemmy.world

President Joe Biden was asked by a reporter in Israel on Wednesday what made him confident that the Israelis weren't behind the explosion that killed hundreds at a Gaza hospital on Tuesday.

Biden responded that it was "the data I was shown by my Defense Department."

Two U.S. officials told ABC News the Pentagon independently concluded the Gaza hospital blast was likely caused by an errant Palestinian Islamic Jihad rocket that fell short of its target.

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[-] freepalestine 115 points 1 year ago

I just want to respectfully remind everyone that just because this tragedy was likely not perpetrated by Israel, it does not mean they are absolved of any of the hundreds of war crimes they have already committed.

[-] praise_idleness@sh.itjust.works 56 points 1 year ago

Just because they did a lot of bad things doesn't mean that you can blatantly lie about killing 500 civilians and then get away with it. Can Israel lie about Hamas beheading 500 babies? And when they do, are you going to accept the narrative of well even if they didn't do it, they did a lot of bad things? Don't think so.

I get why you're saying that, but that doesn't help anyone.

[-] SilentStorms@lemmy.dbzer0.com 14 points 1 year ago

I mean, Isreal bombed that same hospital 2 days earlier, was conducting bombing campaigns in the area, ordered the evacuation of the hospital less than 24 hours before, and kept changing their story around it. It was a pretty fair assumption that it was them until more evidence was produced.

[-] Fades@lemmy.world 14 points 1 year ago

Could you please provide a source on the bombing of the same hospital 2 days earlier by Israel?

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[-] agitatedpotato@lemmy.dbzer0.com 49 points 1 year ago

They killed multiple journalists earlier this week and killed at least 6 in a strike on a school and this hospital debacle has drowned all of that out.

[-] YeetPics@mander.xyz 36 points 1 year ago

Can we hold hamas (and palestine for giving them a holdout) for their war crimes, or is your logic only one-way?

[-] WhiteHawk@lemmy.world 14 points 1 year ago

No, people here are incapable of thinking in anything other than black-and-white

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[-] snooggums@kbin.social 16 points 1 year ago

Yeah, is there any place in southern Gaza that isn't packed full of the people they told to move there from the north for 'safety'?

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[-] Daiken@lemmy.world 85 points 1 year ago

The problem I have with this narrative isn't who dropped the bomb. Tbh they're probably right it was a Palestinian missile. It's the sheer audacity for all these western countries to be shocked and say let's figure this out, as Israel just dropped like 6000 bombs in 6 days. They're worried about one bomb but not the 6000 others, cause ya know, those were killing only Hamas and not injured people in a hospital /s.

While the Muslim world looks on in horror at more bombing in a conflict that has been going on for decades, the western world is focused on insignificant details. Who carried out what attack. Who dropped what bomb. Which act is more morally reprehensible. None of this solves the problem of a displaced people. Only the US can pressure Israel to accept a two state solution. That's the only peaceful solution possible for this conflict imo. The other solution is to wipe out Gaza and the West Bank and everyday we're getting closer to that.

[-] c0mbatbag3l@lemmy.world 20 points 1 year ago

The western world is focused on insignificant details. Who carried out what attack. Who dropped what bomb. Which act is more morally reprehensible. None of this solves the problem of a displaced people

Misinformation on the scale of "a building was destroyed that clearly is still intact" deserves focus. If they'll lie about shit that can be confirmed with a tiny bit of research, what else is getting exaggerated?

[-] feedum_sneedson@lemmy.world 19 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I don't know, most of the papers in the UK led with a front page item on how Israel had killed 500 people by bombing a hospital. So if that wasn't actually true, it's quite important.

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[-] ParsnipWitch@feddit.de 19 points 1 year ago

A two-state-solution doesn't work in part because extremist Muslim groups want the are to be purely Muslim. They would continue to attack Israel with terror tactics, Like they did from the start. What is your solution to that?

[-] Pogbom@lemmy.world 17 points 1 year ago

Swap Muslim with Jewish and Israel with Palestine and it's the same problem... to be clear I think both are true but it's kinda weird to single one out.

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[-] TheSanSabaSongbird@lemdro.id 15 points 1 year ago

The reason for the focus is that it was deliberately being used in a disinformation campaign. Were that not the case, I think you're right that it would have faded into the background noise as just one bomb among 6000 others.

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[-] givesomefucks@lemmy.world 45 points 1 year ago
  1. He was asked on the street by a random reporter.

  2. His quote includes "likely"

  3. For the last couple years Bidens off the cuff remarks haven't exactly been reliable.

Yet people are treating this as an official stance of the US Government...

[-] li10@feddit.uk 50 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I’ll take what the president says as the stance of the US government, and I don’t think that’s remotely unreasonable…

If he’s making mistakes with off the cuff remarks, then he needs to stop making off the cuff remarks.

[-] kent_eh@lemmy.ca 11 points 1 year ago

I’ll take what the president says as the stance of the US government

It's certainly more likely to be the correct way if looking at it than it was a few short years ago.

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[-] vertigo3pc@lemmy.world 39 points 1 year ago

"Iraq has WMD's" is a similar statement, backed by an entire administration, that also led to unnecessary deaths.

Its a political statement, because if Israel did attack the hospital, then that's another outright war crime right after Israel was threatened by Jordan, Lebanon, and Iran.

[-] iAmTheTot@kbin.social 28 points 1 year ago

Uh, did you miss this part?

Two U.S. officials told ABC News the Pentagon independently concluded

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[-] praise_idleness@sh.itjust.works 38 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

For the reference, this is about 500 people:

Some radical estimations talked of -1000 deaths. This is 1000 people:

[-] azertyfun@sh.itjust.works 31 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Both of those estimates come from Hamas sources (well the 1000 people one IDK where you got that from).

JFC people you can criticize Israel without gobbling up a terrorist organization's fat propaganda dick. For now we just have no way to know how many people died in that hospital. Find another war crime to criticize Israel for, they're not that hard to come by.

[-] praise_idleness@sh.itjust.works 28 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

You don't get it. This is to show how ridiculous 500 people claim is. Was the parking lot full of clown cars? If not, 500 claim is pretty much self evident fake news, let alone a thousand.

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[-] halfempty@kbin.social 34 points 1 year ago

I don't consider the Pentagon to be a reliable source for information when they have a vested interest in the conflict. Remember when they said Saddam Hussain had "weapons of mass destruction" which was used to justify the Iraq invasion? Well there never were any. The Pentagon manufactured that disinformation, and media parroted it like loyal puppets.

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[-] nephs@lemmy.world 27 points 1 year ago

Pentagon. The security agency of the country vetoing ceasefire agreement in the UN security council, in favour of Israel attacks.

Independently of whom, exactly?

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[-] GiovaMC@lemmy.world 26 points 1 year ago

This reads like: "we investigated ourselves and found we did nothing wrong"...

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[-] itscozydownhere@lemmy.world 26 points 1 year ago

I mean. Fuck both. But fuck Hamas more.

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[-] Semi-Hemi-Demigod@kbin.social 22 points 1 year ago

Is Islamic Jihad distinct from Hamas?

Yes, you can usually find it abbreviated as PIJ and supposedly has ties to Iran

[-] Nougat@kbin.social 15 points 1 year ago

It is a different group. How much they align with each other and/or cooperate, I do not know.

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[-] JewGoblin@lemmy.world 17 points 1 year ago

you mean the hospital parking lot?

[-] Socsa@sh.itjust.works 15 points 1 year ago

The video seems pretty clear tbh. An aircraft dropping bombs would be quite loud, and a missile would be visible.

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[-] sndmn@lemmy.ca 14 points 1 year ago

Colin Powell has entered the chat.

[-] eestileib@sh.itjust.works 15 points 1 year ago

I haven't seen anything personally convincing, there's a photo of a pothole that's supposed to prove something I guess?

And the US government has a long and costly history of making up accusations against Arab Muslims.

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[-] noevidenz@infosec.pub 12 points 1 year ago

If anyone made it as far as the third sentence in the article, they might notice that "Islamic Jihad" in the title refers to "Palestinian Islamic Jihad".

They're not blaming Hamas for this incident. PIJ is a separate organisation.

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this post was submitted on 18 Oct 2023
405 points (86.4% liked)

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