Have Session added forward secrecy back in yet? If not then it's not all that secure imo.
I have a strange love in my heart for IPFS. I can't justify it, but it's there. Beautiful atoms... such promise...
any guide on how to start using it?
Same
Croc file share, uses a relay to find each other https://github.com/schollz/croc
Session Messenger, uses a tor style server network https://github.com/session-foundation/session-android
croc looks very much alike magic-wormhole
Session Messenger is great, already added to the list
Yes pretty much exact
Magic Wormhole comes close. I don't think it 100% peer-to-peer since there's a coordination server, but that's not so different to most P2P programs on the internet, which need something like a STUN or TURN server (or port mapping) to get around NAT.
thanks a lot!
Yggsrqsil network I2P Freenet https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B.A.T.M.A.N. IPFS SSB / Manyver.se / PZP Briar Project Tailscale Syncthing Localsend
There are lots of others, but most either shut down, got turned into scams, or were always scams.
There was one chat app I remember, I think it was called firechat or something. They ended up removing all the P2P features from it and removed all references from their advertising.
Yggsrqsil network I2P Freenet [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B.A.T.M.A.N](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B.A.T.M.A.N
have great potential but not user friendly at all at current stage. Or is there any user friendly software that uses this I didn't find?
IPFS SSB /
Any guide on how to start using IPFS?
No longer in active development
https://forum.f-droid.org/t/why-was-manyverse-removed-from-f-droid/33750
PZP
Can't find anything on internet
Briar Project
great stuff already in the list
Tailscale
added to the list
Syncthing Localsend
I don't think they are p2p since they can only work in LAN
SSB (Secure ScuttleButt) is the protocol behind the app Manyver.se
There are some issues with it though, so the lead dev of Manyver.se created PZP as a sort of revival of the project. Unfortunately, funding ran out and other commitments took priority, so he had to step away from the project right after its first release. It's functional, but barbones and in desperate need of developers.
Yeah, Freenet is not user friendly at all. Ive tried a few times, but was unable to get it running at all. I2P I had similar issues with, though I did get to try it out. The main thing is that it needs a browser dedicated to it to work properly and is finicky.
Yggdrasil I actually found to be rather polished. It just makes a new network adapter like Tailscale so it's compatible with pretty much everything. Main issue i had was DNS. That, and a lack of content or new features. Its the same now as it was 5 years ago, even with regular updates. There's just very few websites on yggsrasil.
IPFS is complicated. Its harder to setup, but comes bundled in lots of other apps. My main issue both it is a general lack of polish and quality of life features. It has everything else though. Its a functional p2p internet that works both alongside and instead of the regular internet. Its just really clunky amd unpleasant to use, is slow, and doesn't have much content on it. Its also riddled with scams and crypto crap taking advantage of it and ruining everything.
Syncthing doesn't only work on LAN, it can work through any network interface including Tailscale and yggdrasil, and has public relay nodes in case you don't. I'm pretty sure you can also host your own relay nodes if you want to.
ooh nice to see B.A.T.M.A.N here! i had built a simple wrapper to setup mesh networks with batman. it's a bit old but still works if you have an OS with python, systemd and linux kernel.
Monero - private, permissionless, decentralized, p2p, digital cash system.
Reticulum - cryptography-based networking stack designed to build secure, decentralized, and resilient local or wide-area networks using readily available hardware. It operates independently of traditional internet protocols (like IP), enabling communication under adverse conditions such as high latency and extremely low bandwidth with:
Basically internet 2.0
Arweave - private, permissionless, decentralized, p2p, permanent data storage/server.
Thanks, though Reticulum and Arweave can be a bit difficult to use, not sure what exe to download and what platforms are supported
Check out qaul.net
cool stuff, but without GUI many people might not willing to use it
There is a GUI, ready to use apps exist for all the major OSes.
Tox is interesting, though potentially less secure than Briar as they rolled their own encryption and have not been audited (afaik).
check Session Messenger, uses a tor style server network https://github.com/session-foundation/session-android
there is gnu jami - messenger and video/audio calls
gnu jami
It seems great, but it seems to have fewer features than Briar and Session Messenger.
well briar does not have calling on desktop (in stable yet at least), also jami can do video and screen share, and session is not p2p. what most p2p chats lack is users.
well briar does not have calling on desktop (in stable yet at least), also jami can do video and screen share
that's good to know.
what most p2p chats lack is users.
Exactly. In order to attract more users to Jami, I really think the user interface should be improved.
session is not p2p.
you are right, Session is not purely peer-to-peer.
session is basiclly federated (the same model as email and fediverse), where there are different nodes for session. and unlike mail fediverse federation, (if i am not wrong) they have balanced nodes, so basically traffic is spread rather uniformly. as for motivation for starting a node, there are not many, nodes basically form a block chain of sorts and also have something like tor (called lokinet) which also makes your comms hidden.
i personally never got into session, because it seemed like too hard and complex (i do not like using complex software. even if i do not read to run server nodes for it, i should atleast know how it works to understand my safety model). and unlike signal (session started as a hard fork of signal afaik), they broke pfs (perfect forward secrecy - basically something magically, which makes it so that if some bad actor broke encryption for one of your messages, they can not do that for next message)
I’ve never understood why a messaging app would require blockchain to function. Storing all text and images on the blockchain seems redundant—especially when end-to-end encryption is already in place. With E2EE, no one can modify your messages without access to your private key.
It’s a shame they broke Perfect forward secrecy. To me, this is a very important feature to have in any E2EE system.
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