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submitted 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) by CosmicCleric@lemmy.world to c/technology@lemmy.world

cross-posted from: https://lemmy.world/post/10799766

(Edit: Cross-posted OP (link above) was mod removed by the Discord forum 'admin' on 2024-01-19 as being "False claim, false interpreted", so the above link will no longer work.)

Recently read this on a Steam game's reviews section ...

User Comment...

The game's Discord REQUIRES your personal phone number to get access at all. This is a very intrusive, and 100% unnecessary requirement, in order to just be able to interact with others about the game, it's content, player experiences, and many other things. It's also intrusive in regards to being able to contribute any input to help other players in any way at all.

Dev Response...

It's Discord that's asking you for verification of the account. We're not getting your phone number. This is standard practice on bigger servers that allows for a better user experience, filtering bots/ spam accounts, trolls, etc.

Could companies please STOP lying about it being Discord's choice, its not, is the Discord server's choice to ask for it.

Its a "Verification Levels" setting that the server op sets, and they have multiple options that they can choose from, its not an on/off switch. They can dial it back one notch and still have spam/bot protections.

The only difference between "High" and "Highest" verification levels is the addition of asking for a phone number, all other features of "High" is in "Highest", and "Highest" has no other extra features besides asking for the phone number.

Makes it really hard to have an pseudonym account on the Internet, for gaming purposes, and then be asked for your real phone number. I don't need to be tracked 24/7.

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[-] LWD@lemm.ee 28 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)
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[-] Rootiest@lemmy.world 23 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

I came across this issue on my own discord server, the system kinda encourages you towards those higher security levels without really being especially clear about what it will do to the user experience.

One thing I would clear up though:

I think both sides in the OP are correct here.

Yes, the server admin sets the security level that triggers those requirements.

But it's also true that the server/admins do not get your phone number, that private information is only kept within discord's verification system. It is not sent to the server admins.

[-] MoogleMaestro@kbin.social 20 points 10 months ago

I mean, I sort of get why the developers say it's Discord's policy even if it's a bit misleading.

Game developers don't really want to moderate their own discord server and simply want to use the strictest automated filtering system available and this just happens to include phone number linking. The operators of the servers themselves do not have access to these phone numbers and they are only stored by discord directly to prevent spam.

I would personally prefer games to not have their communities tied to discord, akin to how forums were big deal for games back in the day, but even then they do need some kind of automated way to filter out all the crap. This is a problem with moderating any community, including a lemmy/kbin/mastodon, and I don't blame them for simply picking the strictest option to ease the burden on the 1 or 2 people who are charged with managing these servers (especially if they are unpaid or volunteers, which is a whole other can of worms that shouldn't happen...)

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[-] Construc_@lemmy.world 19 points 10 months ago

it sucks, and it is absolutely necessary for some communities. i work for a small game company and we have one or two people that have gone to extreme lengths to contribute hate and saltiness to everyone there. im talking dozens of alt accounts made over the course of years. discord provides the tools for these verification paths. its a choice on behalf of the discord managers to enforce the different levels of verification, but it is absolutely discord that stores and verifies that data. we've tried other methods before, like alt identifier bots, and ive been in communities that do personal ID verification, and neither of those are trustworthy. discord is doing their best, and the kinds of people that complain about these things either are ignorant of the challenges such communities face, or are themselves the problem.

[-] philpo@feddit.de 7 points 10 months ago

As Discord is still unable to provide a GDPR compliant process for the phone number thing (and let's not even start about personal ID), if I were a small game dev I would rather not make myself liable the way one does when using this - it's simply fucking expensive.

[-] thoughts3rased@sopuli.xyz 7 points 10 months ago

But it's not the game dev that handles the information, so the game studio wouldn't be at fault. The game dev never gets that info so isn't storing anything. Discord would be liable for any GDPR infractions.

[-] philpo@feddit.de 3 points 10 months ago

Nope, doesn't work that way. The game dev is offering a networked service (community,support,etc.)in his name/trademark/brand and therefore is therefore liable for the data protection, it doesn't matter at all if the dev is the data holder or not - that's up to the dev to manage contractually with discord.

The concept of "not holding the data, not liable for the data" has been turned down by various high court rulings by now - Amazon and Microsoft amongst others have tried it and lost.

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[-] PhiAU@lemmy.world 18 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Discord has 5 levels of user verification.

None.(none)
Verified email. (Low)
Verified email + more than 5 minutes old account. (Medium)
Verified email + >5 mins old account + member of server for more than 10 mins. (High)
Verified email + >5 mins old account + server member >10 mins + verified phone number. (Highest)

Server admins can set the level. Some server sizes or types (community severs etc.) have a discord-mandated minimum level to qualify for the server type.

Normally (Medium) or (High) security is more than enough. Servers that experience raiding or high levels of trolling are recommended to choose (Very High) security as it makes it harder to make multiple accounts and evade bans or brigade a server.

Discord store the number. The server never sees those details.

Servers that ask for ID to ensure you are over age, are doing that in their own, and probably illegally handling that data, without adequate security.

The server sets the security level. Discord does the enforcing. It IS discord asking for the phone number. But only because the server asked Discord to. But the server definately doesn't see your phone number.

I run a game community server, and normally have security set at medium.

If raided, it goes to High.
If persistently trolled by a user or users that are ban evading (has happened only once), I turn it to highest for a bit.

But I turn it back down after a bit.

A bigger server might not get that luxury.
If a server has stupid high security settings, chances are they have active troublemakers.

[-] brianorca@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago

What does the "5 minute" rule even do? Any bot can be programmed to wait that long, or have a few accounts lined up to use in sequence.

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[-] tabular@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago

I'd like to see what they say if you tell them you don't have a phone number.

[-] Kanzar@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Probably "get one". Or "use a friend's".

[-] Kolanaki@yiffit.net 1 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

The times I have run into this verification stuff, it's for servers that want to be for adults only. And so would much rather just give Discord my phone number than a copy of my ID to the server owner, like most of them want to verify I am over 18.

It's not hard to get a toss away phone number you can use for these things or for 2FA stuff. Like a throwaway email.

[-] planish@sh.itjust.works 4 points 10 months ago

How does one go about doing that? Because Google Voice doesn't seem to cut it.

I could stop trying to use Discord and drive to Best Buy and buy a cell phone and pay for a month of service. Then I could add the number to the account. Then if I stop paying for the monthly service, there's a good chance that Discord or whoever won't believe I'm me at some future login and will demand I give them a code they sent to the phone number on file.

[-] yamanii@lemmy.world 1 points 10 months ago

I just searched for it and got into some shady free service that didn't even need an account, the only caveat is that you are sharing that temporary phone number with several people, and it will probably stop existing in some days, just enough to create an account.

[-] brianorca@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago

Which means when they ask to verify your number again in 6 months, or after a computer upgrade, you are SOL without that specific phone number.

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[-] CosmicCleric@lemmy.world 0 points 10 months ago

The times I have run into this verification stuff, it’s for servers that want to be for adults only.

I'm an avid gamer, and most Discord servers that have to do with a certain game, like WoW private servers, etc., require them.

It’s not hard to get a toss away phone number you can use for these things or for 2FA stuff.

I've attempted that a couple of times, and Discord has detected them and rejected them every time. There's some kind of identifier associated with a phone number that allows Discord to determine if it comes from a third party source.

There's many articles and Reddit style conversations about the issue, if you want to read up on it further.

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this post was submitted on 16 Jan 2024
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