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BreadPanes 58: "Corporatism, Not Capitalism"
(lemmy.ml)
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this post was submitted on 07 Sep 2025
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Political ideologies don't kill people. Individuals kill people.
Capitalism happens to reward this kind of behaviour but it doesn't "cause" it.
Edit: ML users don't seem to have a concept of nuanced political discussion. Should we just forgive these crimes against humanity on the individual level and blame an ideology instead? Is it true that communism inherently involves the death of millions of people? Or were those bad actors doing bad things because they are bad people?
Edit 2: Capitalism is a symptom not the cause. Until we address what led us to capitalism we will never see a better world.
Individuals don’t exist in a vacuum though. Ideologies and systems shape behavior by setting the rules of the game and defining what gets rewarded or punished. Under capitalism, exploitation, profit-over-people, and competition are incentivized, so it does cause patterns of harm — not just isolated bad actors. That’s why we see consistent violence, poverty, and dispossession under capitalism across the globe. It’s not random individuals — it’s a system rewarding destructive behavior.
You are just restating what I said.
My criticism is that blaming "capitalism" for the actions taken by individuals or collective actions taken by the group moves the blame away from the individuals committing those actions. Which is not helpful.
People do bad stuff because they are bad. I live in a capitalist county but choose not to bad things to people because I'm not a bad person.
FWIW I am anarchist so INB4 "supporting capitalism".
Also, that's not what downvotes are for but whatever.
Okay, let's place the blame on the individuals. Now what? We imprison them in a neverending cycle while ignoring the conditions that created them? That would be like mopping up the blood forever from a hospital floor while doing nothing to suture any wounds. The problem with a myopic moralistic view is that it is incapable of actually changing anything. All it tells us how to do is sit in judgement, not contemplate causes.
capitalism is a system that gives an individual the potential authority to literally own an entire fucking city, can you please like eat shit
Idk who you think you are arguing with but it's clearly not me haha.
I think I'm arguing with an actual child who is incapable of understanding things in terms larger than individual interactions, who literally cannot conceive of the incredible political authority afforded to the capitalist class which, consequently, affords their "individual" actions (which tend to have extreme class solidarity, lol) an inordinate amount of influence over our society, to the point where your mention of "individual responsibility" really comes off as an ignorant fucking child wanking off and thinking they're smart and special
you're a liberal despite your anarcho-jacketing so I know you worship authority figures, so here's albert einstein with Baby's First Theory explaining how capitalism is inherently authoritarian:
anyway go off about how individual responsibility matters more than an economic system which allows a single individual to literally own your entire fucking state! hope you read a fucking book in your entire life that isn't harry potter
The projection here is palpable.
I won't engage in your straw man argument but to be absolutely clear, I am not defending capitalism in any way shape or form. There is not a single cell in my body that endorses this shit.
That being said, I'm not content with blaming a political system. I want to hold individuals accountable for their actions. I want bad actors eliminated from society regardless of their purported political beliefs.
Bad actors exist in every form of social and political structures. It is absolutely critical that these anti-social individuals are ousted from the group.
You are oversimplifying things because it's easier than understanding the big picture. It's easy to think that political ideologies can fix things. They can't without a deeper understanding of human/animal group behaviour.
Einstein had some interesting things to say but I would suggest reading Kropotkin if you want to understand more about the true nature of social structures and the relationship between the individual and the group.
How exactly are you proposing we do this? If re-education or some similar imprisonment system works successfully, then it would be our current system (capitalisms) fault for their anti-social behavior. If on the other hand you mean they should be killed, isn't that exactly the anti-social behavior your complaining about?
I don't have a good answer on how to deal with these people specifically. There are too many potential variables to really make a conclusive statement about this. It depends so much on the social structures we're acting within.
i will say I don't think killing is inherently anti-social. If the death of an individual who is working against the wellbeing of the community is the only way to improve the health of the community then I would not consider causing their death to be anti-social.
For a "spherical cows in a vacuum" argument, I would say that if there is a community locked in a box where no one is free to come and go, and a member of that community is engaging in rape or murder, I would support them being killed. There is obviously a whole world of discussion to just be had on this example and I'm over simplifying.
The specifics are more of a moral/ethical problem than a political/social problem imo.
Congrats, you are the actual cringiest person I have encountered on the fediverse.
Every comment you post just projects harder that you are comically insecure and immature.
It's honestly sad and confusing to see behaviour like this out of someone who claims to be a leftist but I suppose you may be on the path to becoming the anti-social bad actor I'm warning about.
I'm sitting here trying to have an actual political discussion but instead laughing at how it feels like I'm arguing with an LLM trained exclusively on 4chan posts and brain rot Rick & Morty memes.
It's ok to be wrong sometimes. I used to think the same way you do but then I decided to read actual theory and educate myself on the nuances of leftist thought.
What is not ok is to drag down well meaning conversation because it makes you feel insecure.
I'm not going to block you because I have hope that you may grow as a person and some day have some meaningful things to add to discussions of this nature but I'm completely done entertaining this "conversation".
Feel free to continue shit posting meme lord gifs in an effort to feel like you have things to say but I'm out.
Take your own advice, and go think about why every individual "decides" to get wet when it rains
lmao k