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[-] wheezy@lemmy.ml 10 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

I mean, honestly, if you really want to solidify the appearance of "not being a threat" this definitely works well. The problem is that the machine of state violence under fascism does not give a fuck. Non peaceful protest only works when the government has some care in the public response. It is useless if there is not an audience with power to convince of the injustice. Just ask the Palestinians during the Great March of Return (or countless other peaceful means of resistance throughout their history). No one with power gave a single fuck.

Dr. King’s policy was that nonviolence would achieve the gains … His major assumption was that if you are nonviolent, if you suffer, your opponent will see your suffering and will be moved to change his heart. That’s very good. He only made one fallacious assumption: In order for nonviolence to work, your opponent must have a conscience. The United States has none. - Stokely Carmichael

Waiting for the CIA to do a false flag event in one of these outfits to ban costumes like this. But I don't think they care enough. They aren't afraid of a video of police beating the shit out of a dude in a costume. They already put pepper spray in the air intakes.

Americans need to drop the MLK mindset and go Black Panther Party right fucking now.

Non violence cannot be the only response to further violence.

[-] witten@lemmy.world 3 points 3 months ago

The point of non-violence isn't to sway the opinions of ICE or the Trump regime. The purpose of non-violence is to gain and maintain the support of the general public while dismantling the pillars of support for authoritarianism.

As soon as you start mercing people, you lose public support from the normies, and the bad guys get a justification to meet force with even more force. It's not a winning strategy.

[-] wheezy@lemmy.ml 1 points 3 months ago

I'm not talking about random mercenary acts. I'm talking about defending yourself and your community from literal military invasion. For some reason self defensive violence is entirely understandable and just to most people. It's a fundamental part of any justice system. Unless that self defensive violence is done in return to unjust state violence.

Everyone was rightfully ready to cheer on the Ukrainian civilians taking up arms against the Russian invasion. But, suddenly, when it's happening here, that's unjustifiable.

"Convincing the normies" won't matter when you're sitting in a labor camp.

Concerning nonviolence, it is criminal to teach a man not to defend himself when he is the constant victim of brutal attacks.

We are nonviolent with people that are nonviolent with us.

-Malcolm X

[-] witten@lemmy.world 0 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Notice I said nothing about what is just or unjust. I'm strictly talking tactics. And at this moment in the Trump regime's authoritarian breakthrough, non-violence is still our best bet. History of these sorts of breakthroughs shows that authoritarian regimes are best countered by broad-based public resistance. And yes, that means from normies.

As soon as you start shooting back, you yield the upper hand to ICE and the regime's goons. They know how to deal with violence... It is their language. What they don't know how to deal with is a pissed-off grandma in a chicken costume with the full moral backing of 70% of the population.

[-] wheezy@lemmy.ml 0 points 3 months ago

The grandma will still die from breathing in the pepper spray they put in the air intake of the suite. You're saying deaths of innocent protesters are worth it? I'm sorry, but have you been to a protest where ICE gets violent? Are you waiting until someone is killed? Because that's already happened.

We should remain nonviolent in the face of our allies being abducted, tortured, and killed? Where is the line for you? Honestly?

Because I'm not saying this to get people to go do random acts of violence against ICE. I'm saying this so that people like you realize that the preparation for a resistance is needed NOW. You don't just go out and be violent. That's not at all what the Black Panther Party was doing. And honestly, that preparation is likely far too late even now.

[-] witten@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

When ICE commits violence against the unarmed grandma in the chicken suit, they radicalize ten more grandmas—and solidify the position of the normies against ICE.

And anyone who shows up to a protest is making their own risk assessment. Some protests are the strollers and marches type, and that's a pretty low risk level. Some protests are spicier, and they tend to draw a different crowd with a different risk tolerance.

And yes, I'm saying we should remain non-violent in the face of ICE's atrocities, because that is the best tactic for gaining and retaining the wide-spread support necessary to defeat them.

I think the part you're missing is what that support gets us. When there's wide-spread support for those opposing ICE, that gives us more of an ability (and the people power) to attack the pillars of support that prop up the authoritarian regime.

[-] WolfLink@sh.itjust.works 2 points 3 months ago

Trump might not have a conscience but certainly at least some of the soldiers who were ordered there will.

[-] wheezy@lemmy.ml 1 points 3 months ago

Fascism is Imperialism turned inwards. The US soldiers have been fine with it when we do it to other countries civilians. As long as they believe the narrative and the majority continue to follow orders it won't matter if a couple Joes have a conscience.

Why do you think Trump wants to bring in military when the police force is more than capable of brutalizing protesters? He wants that complete disconnection from any loyalty to the cities he invades.

this post was submitted on 13 Oct 2025
276 points (98.9% liked)

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