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PSA: Lemmy votes can be manipulated
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this post was submitted on 09 Jul 2023
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Upvotes aren't just a number, they determine placing on the algorithm along with comments. It's easy to censor an unwanted view by mass downvoting it.
Some instances don't allow downvoting. It doesn't really matter, mass upvoting the remaining content has the same effect.
I disagree, i just got massively bandwagon downvoted into oblivion in this thread and noticed that as soon as a single downvote hits, it's like blood in the water and the piranhas will instantly downvote, even if its nonsensical. Downvotes act as a guide for people that don't really think about the message contents, and need instructions on how to vote. I'd love if comments got their votes censored for 1 hour after posting.
Better if the votes are permanently hidden to users and are only visible to mods, admins and the system.
You are absolutely right. Best solution. I've tried to think of different ways to do it and your way is just hands down easiest and best. Thanks for saying it.
I don’t think obstructing or hiding votes is the way to go. Them being public is actually better and it should be transparent to all users. Besides that what prevents spammers and vote manipulators to setup their own instances to see the votes?
That sounds like a solution that basic administration/moderation is meant to solve. You need to feel how bad brigading is to understand the need to not be able to downvote/see downvotes. Other instances can see the votes, which keeps the system honest and removes the need for individual users to have transparency.
I was referring to bots: whether they downvote one post/comment to -1000, or upvote the rest to +1000, the effect is the same... for anyone sorting by votes.
In regards to people, I agree that downvotes are not really constructive, that's why beehav.org doesn't allow them.
But in general, I'm afraid Lemmy will have to end up offering similar vote related features as Reddit: hide vote counts for some period of time, "randomize" them a bit to drive bots crazy, and that kind of stuff.
For bots the simple effect on the algorithm is similar either way, i agree. When we can see the downvotes though is my problem. If bots downvote you -1000 then it gives admins more info to control bot brigading, but helps users act like chimps and just mash the downvote button. Imagine having a bot group that just downvotes someone you don't like by a reasonable number of votes for the context. You'd be so doomed. If that same bot group only gave upvotes to the bot-user then it'd be totally different in the thread.