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submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by SeventyTwoTrillion@hexbear.net to c/news@hexbear.net

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Friendly reminder: when commenting about a news event, especially something that just happened, please provide a source of some kind. While ideally this would be on nitter or archived, any source is preferable to none at all given.

If you have evidence of Israeli crimes and atrocities that you wish to preserve, there is a thread here in which to do so.


Sources on the fighting in Palestine against Israel. In general, CW for footage of battles, explosions, dead people, and so on:

UNRWA daily-ish reports on Israel's destruction and siege of Gaza and the West Bank.

English-language Palestinian Marxist-Leninist twitter account. Alt here.
English-language twitter account that collates news (and has automated posting when the person running it goes to sleep).
Arab-language twitter account with videos and images of fighting.
English-language (with some Arab retweets) Twitter account based in Lebanon.
English-language Palestinian Twitter account which reports on news from the Resistance Axis.

English-language PalestineResist telegram channel.
More telegram channels here for those interested.

Various sources that are covering the Ukraine conflict are also covering the one in Palestine, like Rybar.


The Country of the Week is still Palestine, though we will switch next week to a new country.


Here is the map of the Ukraine conflict, courtesy of Wikipedia.

The weekly (biweekly?) update is here.

Links and Stuff


The bulletins site is down.

Examples of Ukrainian Nazis and fascists

Examples of racism/euro-centrism during the Russia-Ukraine conflict

Add to the above list if you can.


Resources For Understanding The War


Defense Politics Asia's youtube channel and their map. Their youtube channel has substantially diminished in quality but the map is still useful.

Moon of Alabama, which tends to have interesting analysis. Avoid the comment section.

Understanding War and the Saker: reactionary sources that have occasional insights on the war.

Alexander Mercouris, who does daily videos on the conflict. While he is a reactionary and surrounds himself with likeminded people, his daily update videos are relatively brainworm-free and good if you don't want to follow Russian telegram channels to get news. He also co-hosts The Duran, which is more explicitly conservative, racist, sexist, transphobic, anti-communist, etc when guests are invited on, but is just about tolerable when it's just the two of them if you want a little more analysis.

On the ground: Patrick Lancaster, an independent and very good journalist reporting in the warzone on the separatists' side.

Unedited videos of Russian/Ukrainian press conferences and speeches.


Telegram Channels

Again, CW for anti-LGBT and racist, sexist, etc speech, as well as combat footage.

Pro-Russian

https://t.me/aleksandr_skif ~ DPR's former Defense Minister and Colonel in the DPR's forces. Russian language.

https://t.me/Slavyangrad ~ A few different pro-Russian people gather frequent content for this channel (~100 posts per day), some socialist, but all socially reactionary. If you can only tolerate using one Russian telegram channel, I would recommend this one.

https://t.me/s/levigodman ~ Does daily update posts.

https://t.me/patricklancasternewstoday ~ Patrick Lancaster's telegram channel.

https://t.me/gonzowarr ~ A big Russian commentator.

https://t.me/rybar ~ One of, if not the, biggest Russian telegram channels focussing on the war out there. Actually quite balanced, maybe even pessimistic about Russia. Produces interesting and useful maps.

https://t.me/epoddubny ~ Russian language.

https://t.me/boris_rozhin ~ Russian language.

https://t.me/mod_russia_en ~ Russian Ministry of Defense. Does daily, if rather bland updates on the number of Ukrainians killed, etc. The figures appear to be approximately accurate; if you want, reduce all numbers by 25% as a 'propaganda tax', if you don't believe them. Does not cover everything, for obvious reasons, and virtually never details Russian losses.

https://t.me/UkraineHumanRightsAbuses ~ Pro-Russian, documents abuses that Ukraine commits.

Pro-Ukraine

Almost every Western media outlet.

https://discord.gg/projectowl ~ Pro-Ukrainian OSINT Discord.

https://t.me/ice_inii ~ Alleged Ukrainian account with a rather cynical take on the entire thing.


Last week's discussion post.


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[-] autismdragon@hexbear.net 51 points 1 year ago

My anti-Zionist jewish friend sent me this tumblr post from another anti-Zionist jew talking about the "how to be Anti-Zionist without being antisemetic" subject, and told me its the first one of those posts that she's largely agreed with.

My friend asks that y'all not leave comments or anything please :)

I think its interesting that the post says that the "they can just go back, dual citizenship" rhetoric that Ive seen people here using is a problem because it doesnt reflect reality.

Person seems to be pretty comited to ending aparthied so I dont think they're coming at this in bad faith. And so I think these are good points to keep in mind.

[-] YEP@hexbear.net 33 points 1 year ago

I mean it just a factually wrong post that misrepresents what it cites. The majority of Jews in Israel are not indigenous. Yes there are native Palestinian Jews. I've seen this conflation of Sephardic Jews and Mizrahi Jews multiple times verbatim now. It central to the claim that they are indigenous people. Idk if it's just lack of understanding or a purposeful obfuscation. The 31% Ashkenazi number that they reference I assume they saw from Wikipedia that puts 'soviet' Jews in their own category.

The part about not having a place to return to I feel is an over simplification of how citizenship works. I can claim and get Irish citizenship if I do enough paperwork bc of my family heritage. It doesn't make me a active passport holder. It also shouldn't matter there would obviously have to be land reform but I don't think any one with listening to is advocating for the expulsion of all Jews. Look to south Africa whites were not expelled, although they didn't do land reform correctly.

The first point just sounds like every propagandized response to "river to sea". It conflates a free singular state of Palestine with a state that would not tolerate Jews. The only principled solution is one secular state that allows free practice of religion and doesn't discriminate based on racial lines. I've noticed this trend with Ukraine but western liberals actually believe every state must be an ethnostate.

[-] autismdragon@hexbear.net 7 points 1 year ago

"I mean, it really doesn't matter how you count ashkenazi jews. The main point there is that a significant part of the Jewish Israeli population is non-white (and actually oppressed under Israel's white supremacist state)" - My friends response to what I felt was your one fairly legitimate point, the bit about Ashkenazi jews in a separate category from "Soviet" jews. Basically, you're right, but it doesn't matter to op's point.

[-] autismdragon@hexbear.net 4 points 1 year ago

I feel like most of this response is just applying bad faith interpretations to OP's post that just very clearly aren't there based on their rhetoric. I don't want to fine tooth combed all the examples, but all your "corrections" seem to rely on assuming a purpose in what they are saying that just doesn't seem to be there. For example, "don't whitewash Israeli jews" never made the claim that Sephardic jews are indigenous. They also never say anything about people wanting to expel all jews. The thing about the "river to the sea" stuff seems like a HUGE leap based on the text of what was actually written here. They never say anything about a free singular state of Palestine not tolerating jews in that point. Idk where you even got that from. Just bad past experiences I guess? I just dont think those past experiences can be applied here based on OP being pretty clear that nothing justifies apartheid or genocide.

OP's post just seems to stress accuracy in criticism.

[-] YEP@hexbear.net 9 points 1 year ago

I should have been more thorough in my explanations as to not have caused confusion, sorry. Many of these points are not the blunt messaging you see by the most bad faith arbitrators of anti semitism like the adl. I am asserting that the points that are explained here are what is used to underpin many of the bad faith arguments. As an example the argumentation in point 4 is how pro Zionist arguments couch their criticism of the "river to the sea" rallying cry. They equate the abolition of the state of Israel with the expulsion and death of all Jews in Palestine. This is the same way white south Africans painted calls to push "settlers into the sea" obviously we both know there was no white genocide in South Africa.

The other example of the conflation and misrepresentation of Sephardic and mizrahi and native Palestinian Jews underpins much of the claims elsewhere about indgeneity. I brought it up because arguments about indgeneity are absolutely used by people who seek to act as wreckers.

And what you calling out it's outright misrepresentations and lies with a " fine tooth comb" is important. (An aside, I knew it was wrong before looking where they got it, it wasn't some sort of deep investigation, it's a Tumblr post, I assumed they used Wikipedia and I was confirmed by just opening the demographics of Israel page on Wikipedia.) It is not bad faith to point out when the author is either uninformed or lying. I couch this entire argument with the argument of a secular state because your right it doesn't matter. I'm not the one bringing up the point of demographics they are. The fact they are ignorant or worse willingly lie about that argument we both agree doesn't matter should make you skeptical of what they are saying.

Point 3 just drops that people are using anti semitic tropes then pivots to some other point yet again about demographics that is misunderstanding what they are reading from Wikipedia. When they claim "American Israelis only make up about 5% of the Israeli population" In a point about being expelled, again in a secular state we agree they shouldn't be expelled(insert borders are fuck emote), they are conflating American born with Americans. I made my point on Irish citizenship because if you are born to an American parent you are American through birthright. The five percent figure they use is not a figure tied to the point they are trying to make.

AGAIN I DONT THINK JEWS NEED TO BE ETHNICLY CLEANSED TO HAVE A SECULAR AND FREE PALESTINE.

I mean like c'mon point 6 in that Tumblr post is literally "if you replace Zionist with jew you sound anti semitic"smuglord

Sorry if this is all over the place I'm a bad writer and I'm struggling to figure out to format this to adress both your comments.

[-] autismdragon@hexbear.net 3 points 1 year ago

Im a bit tired to parse this right now and I might forget to come back to it but thank you for your input. I think most of my takeaway here is that most of this is good advice in a general sense even if the details are a bit poorly researched? But I'm not sure. The fact that both of the most radical jewish people I know agree with Tumblr OPs points makes me think theres something to it here.

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