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Story of Cruz
(lemmy.world)
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this post was submitted on 29 Oct 2023
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I completely agree. However, if we're talking about solutions, blaming someone like this doesn't get us anywhere, and it certainly won't prevent another similar tragedy.
The people interested in actually solving this problem aren't wasting their time on the motives of the shooters. They are all aberrations, but when the number of aberrations starts rising, that tells you there's a problem in the system, and treating the symptoms won't make it go away.
It will prevent a similar tragedy by blaming him because that involves locking him up so he can't do it again.
You're missing the point when people say it won't solve future issues. Yes, lock the perpetrator up (ignoring the issues with the penal system in the first place), that's a no brainier. But locking up that person and placing all the blame at their feet doesn't do anything for the other people in very similar situations.
Then we're in complete agreement. I think perhaps I'm not the one missing points here.
The person you were talking to was making a broader societal point. Placing the blame for this whole situation, which is the fruit of many of the failings of society, just enacted through a single man, and saying we're good 'cause that boogeyman is dead or in prison does NOTHING to address the root causes, the actual problems. That's the point you're missing.
I understand exactly what they were trying to say.
Unlike them, I'm not making a broader point, I'm not in a larger discussion of societal reform. Attempting to shift this conversation to that is a fault. If you scroll through this thread I've been extremely consistently saying that Cruz bares responsibility for his actions and condemning him does serve a vital, albeit very disheartening, purpose for all of us.
If you think about it from my perspective it seems that the only purpose of talking about the faults of society in the context of my statements would be to detract from Cruz's guilt, which as I stated previously is asinine.
You're painting a false dichotomy, though. Both of these things can be true at the same time, and in fact are. It does everyone more good to accept that yes, Cruz did a bad thing and should be held accountable, and to accept that, yes, society at large has a hand to play in this.
Can they both be true? Because the post we're under claims 100% of the blame goes to Society. I voiced that this was wrong, and suddenly all of you in the replies want to correct me. Give up, mate, you don't even know what you're fighting for. Cruz is responsible for Cruz's actions, if not wholly than in majority part.
What, exactly, prevents both from being true? Cruz is to blame for his actions. Society is to blame for the conditions that led to the actions. They're both true. We can punish, imprison, whatever, the person who did the crime, while still also acknowledging that there may be other things that led to the thing from happening.
Right, so we agree completely, what then are you here to try to explain? We both claim Cruz is to blame for his actions, and that any actions by society as a whole does not absolve him.