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[-] AA5B@lemmy.world 153 points 1 year ago

EVs aren’t working

EVs are the highest growth sector for personal vehicles but are growing a little less than expected, and we can’t make big profits yet

[-] cybersandwich@lemmy.world 30 points 1 year ago

This is a huge point. The other considerations are: EVs are balls expensive compared to ICE counterparts and often require $500-2k worth of electrical work at your house (assuming you even own it) to put in a charger. If you live in an apartment, good luck.

And oh, btw, the chargers aren't standard. Each charging site has different plugs, apps you have to download, etc. Then there is the lack of charging stations that highlights the range anxiety people have with EVs.

Adoption would be so much faster if EVs cost $15-25k and there were adequate standardized charging options available.

[-] DreadPotato@sopuli.xyz 16 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

the chargers aren't standard. Each charging site has different plugs

IDK where you're from, but in europe it's all standardized and all cars, regardless of brand, use the same plug for both AC and DC charging. The whole app/rfid tag mess is true though.

[-] tastysnacks@programming.dev 19 points 1 year ago

Are we doing it in a stupid way? Yes.

You know exactly where we're from.

[-] altima_neo@lemmy.zip 4 points 1 year ago

AMERICA, FUCK YEAH!

[-] someguy3@lemmy.ca 9 points 1 year ago

EVs cost more up front and then cost less with fuel, maintenance, and longevity.

[-] Whoresradish@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago

This is kind of true. A lot of the maintenance requirements for ICE vehicles is not needed for EVs. So you save money on things like oil changes and if you can charge at home then charging is probably cheaper than gas. But that battery probably needs to be replaced after about 5 years and that is a very expensive maintenance cost.

[-] surewhynotlem@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago

I have a 2016 leaf. I've changed the tires. That's the maintenance. It's like $3 to 'fill', and that's about the same as three gallons of ICE distance.

The battery is around 90% of what I bought it at.

I have yet to hit any of the problems people are afraid of, but I might just be lucky.

[-] wtfeweguys@lemmy.whynotdrs.org 7 points 1 year ago

Research suggests otherwise.

An independent analysis of 15,000 EV batteries finds that most don't need to be replaced until they're well over a decade old.

[-] Virulent@reddthat.com 6 points 1 year ago

That might be true for older cars that didn't have good thermal management systems (like the old Nissan leaf) but not true anymore. Electric car batteries now regularly reach over 100k miles with only small degradation. If you baby it, it seems that 200k miles with only 10% range loss is to be expected now

[-] someguy3@lemmy.ca 5 points 1 year ago

No oil, timing belt, transmission. EVs are incredibly simple vehicles. Many years ago Tesla wanted a million mile battery, they are constantly getting better.

[-] proudblond@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

My EV is just over 5 years old and the battery is fine. I know it’s anecdotal but the batteries last longer than projected.

[-] Whoresradish@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago

My 5 year estimate may actually be outdated already fortunately. First article popup about it shows 8 to 12 years now depending on the company and battery type. This is actually fantastic to see that as I was quite worried the tech would stagnate eventually.

https://www.pcmag.com/news/how-long-do-ev-batteries-last-study-says-longer-than-you-think

[-] Illogicalbit@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago

I have a 2015 leaf and while the estimated battery range has gone from 90’s to 60’s on mileage, it’s still kicking and gets me around the city just fine.

[-] AA5B@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

the chargers aren’t standard. Each charging site has different plugs, apps you have to download, etc

-- US has 2.5 common plugs. An old one that’s mostly gone, the standard one, and Tesla. However Tesla opened theirs as a standard, and it looks like they will be de facto standard across the US

-- The protocols are compatible. The adapter for my Tesla to use the other standards is mostly plastic and dumb. You just need something to fit a different socket

-- yes, the state of apps sucks. Everyone wants to maximize their profit. However I thought most non-Tesla chargers had a credit card reader, so as long as you can find it and it works, you can use it without an app. Tesla is another story, but does seem t add a lot of convenience with their app

[-] echodot@feddit.uk 5 points 1 year ago

Yeah so I looked into this little while ago and I own my own house so in theory I can put the box in. The problem is I only have on the street parking and the house is set back away from the road and there's a garden between the road in the house.

So how the bleeding hell am I supposed to charge a car? I'd have to run a long cable through the garden, over the fence, over the pedestrian walkway, over the grass verge and to the car. Someone is going to trip over it and then think they can sue me.

Or the government could just install a street furniture like they do parking metres, but I have no way to force them to do that.

[-] surewhynotlem@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

Personally? I'd have an electrician install a standing charger by the curb. I might end up doing that if my wife switches to a plug in hybrid next year.

I'm not sure how that'll work with the easement though. But that's future me's problem.

[-] AA5B@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

Trench for an underground cable, and mount the charger on a pedestal near your car?

I don’t know about other brands but a Tesla charger can whitelist VINs to only charger your vehicle

[-] abhibeckert@lemmy.world -1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

So how the bleeding hell am I supposed to charge a car? I’d have to run a long cable through the garden

Personally I'd replace part of the garden with a driveway and parking space. Sure, it's ugly. But it's what billions of people around the world have.

Or the government could just install a street furniture like they do parking metres, but I have no way to force them to do that.

Most cities have a plan to do that (though it might just be a plan, with no funding allocated yet)... But there are challenges - in particular vandalism. They have been more successful/cheaper to maintain (and more likely to actually work when you park there) at locations with 24/7 security guards and quick police response times.

They also prioritise short term daytime parking as it's better to charge EVs when direct solar is available - far cheaper than other power source (except hydro, but hydro generally can't produce enough power). And they prioritise somewhere like a shopping district where you might only park for 45 minutes allowing dozens of people to charger their car per day instead of just one overnight. Shopping districts are also setup to prevent vandalism as well (and prevention is cheaper than repairs).

Every shopping mall in my city already has a parking spaces where you can charge an EV. In fact it's often free (or at least, included in the price of parking at the mall). It works well enough but it's never going to be as convenient as charging at home... those parking spaces are nearly always empty in my city, even though they're free people would rather pay for the convenience of charging overnight.

[-] echodot@feddit.uk 2 points 1 year ago

Personally I'd replace part of the garden with a driveway and parking space.

Well I don't really want to have to do that if I can help it because if I did that I wouldn't really have a garden anymore, but also I don't think I can anyway because there's a grass verge and I don't think I own that, I think the city does, and I would have to pull that up to lay the driveway.

But also if I rented I wouldn't be able to do any of that anyway so they still need to go the street furniture route. I don't think vandalisms are particular problem because if they put down load of them they just become common and people would ignore them. Also it's a housing street, it's not a random street in the city so the only people around here are people who live around here and vandalising your own stuff seems pretty dumb. I'm sure it'll happen but I don't think it'll be a major problem.

Every shopping mall in my city already has a parking spaces where you can charge an EV.

In my experiences usually some prick with a pickup truck in them. Apparently it's actually a offence to park in them if you don't have an electric vehicle, but have yet to see the law enforce. One time I saw a cop parked in one so, there you go.

[-] AA5B@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

usually some prick with a pickup truck in them

Yes, but like vandalism, the best answer may be ubiquity. The asshole in the truck can’t get a kick out of offending people if they simply ignore him and goto the next chargers

[-] Mr_Dr_Oink@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

They are planning to put them on streetlamps where i live. That seems like an effective idea.

[-] acutfjg@feddit.nl 3 points 1 year ago

Yep these are all true points, but not unexpected as with any innovation. Just like how computers were immensely expensive, and without standards for decades.

EVs are relatively new in the scope of technology. Capitalism just wants to make you think it's an issue. In reality this is gonna take time and lack the profits every company is striving for, which to them is a failure.

[-] altima_neo@lemmy.zip 7 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Yeah, I keep reading articles saying the same thing. Auto industry and dealers complaining EV sales are slowing down, yet as you said, it's the fastest growing category.

Of course profits aren't as great now coming off that high during expensive fuel prices the last few years, COVID related shortages causing prices to skyrocket, etc. Not to mention inflation decreasing the value of people's income.

[-] atrielienz@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

Automakers also rely on dealers to sell vehicles and the dealers often make most of their money from repairs and maintenance. More than half the maintenance for ICE vehicles is just non-existent on EV's. Not a lot of stuff to do when you get your tires rotated and your brakes checked every 5000k miles.

this post was submitted on 08 Nov 2023
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