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submitted 2 years ago by throws_lemy@lemmy.nz to c/news@beehaw.org
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[-] Swallowtail@beehaw.org 11 points 2 years ago

Go vegan. It's better for the planet too.

[-] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 points 2 years ago

being vegan doesn't help the planet at all.

[-] amzd@kbin.social 8 points 2 years ago

How does reducing land and water use through your food choice not help the planet?

[-] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 points 2 years ago

it doesn't actually reduce the use.

[-] shapesandstuff@feddit.de 6 points 2 years ago

Please don't tell me you're gonna bring up the stupid soy fields in the rain forest argument :'D

[-] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 2 years ago

being vegan doesn't stop soy from being grown in rainforests

[-] shapesandstuff@feddit.de 1 points 2 years ago

exactly, because almost 100% of that soy is for meat production

[-] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 years ago

85% of global soy is pressed for oil. the vast majority of the soy that's fed to animals is the industrial waste from that process.

[-] shapesandstuff@feddit.de 2 points 2 years ago

Wheree do you get your numbers from?

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1254608/soy-production-end-uses-worldwide/

They seem off my guy.

Weird to not provide real numbers for someone calling me a liar

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[-] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 years ago

environmental destruction continues whether you are vegan or not.

[-] shapesandstuff@feddit.de 2 points 2 years ago

also what part of my comment prompted you to post that random response?

[-] shapesandstuff@feddit.de 1 points 2 years ago

yep due to the meat industry keeping going regardless of a fairly small demographic quitting their products

[-] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 years ago

so maybe you should stop lying to people about being vegan helping the planet.

[-] shapesandstuff@feddit.de 2 points 2 years ago

It does, if enough people did it.

You're so angry lol

[-] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 years ago

what makes you think you can tell anything about my emotional state?

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[-] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 years ago

It does, if enough people did it.

do you have a plan to make that happen? how many people is enough?

[-] shapesandstuff@feddit.de 1 points 2 years ago

Are u moving goal posts to feel like you're winning something or genuinely expect the comment section in an online forum to solve societal issues?

Less meat produced = better.

How much more better things could be a different wat is irrelevant; using that as an excuse to never do anything is actually damaging.

[-] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)
[-] shapesandstuff@feddit.de 1 points 2 years ago

Yeah, what does that have to do with veganism? Tiny niche doesnt stop global trend. Who knew?

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[-] SinAdjetivos@beehaw.org 1 points 2 years ago

You are making the false assumption that your consumption is causative to the production of animal products which is, unfortunately and non-intuituvely, untrue. The only difference between vegan and non-vegan diets is whether animal products end up on your plate vs. in "cheese mountain" type stockpiles, exports, landfills, etc.

That being said, 'commie' is a terrible communicator if that's what they're trying to say. Going vegan does help to highlight some of the contradictions of capitalism and you're on the right track as it should be advocated for. However, the 'invisible hand of the free market' does not translate veganism to any reduction in farmed animals, land or water use.

[-] amzd@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago

“If you don’t buy it a company will throw it away instead” is not a very good argument to buy something if you even believe it to be true at all.

[-] SinAdjetivos@beehaw.org 1 points 2 years ago

That's not what I'm saying, I'm saying the act of "not buying it" (even if it was a complete and total boycott) has no impact on the production due to the system of subsidies, futures, derivatives, etc. that is set up explicitly to make sure production continues. And therefore has no impact on land/water usage, suffering etc.

With the point being that it's a good first step, but if your expectation is it will change anything without first changing the underlying system you will be very disappointed.

[-] amzd@kbin.social 4 points 2 years ago

Your argument is called the nirvana fallacy;

“World peace would be ideal; this peace treaty fails to completely achieve world peace; therefore this peace treaty is not worth doing.”

And I do not accept that.

[-] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 years ago

it's not a nirvana fallacy. they're actually right, being vegan has no impact at all. a peace treaty actually creates peace. buying beans just means beans are sold, it doesn't do anything to change any of the problems.

[-] rautapekoni@sopuli.xyz 2 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

Surely the societal pressure to change the systems that support factory farming of animals will grow pretty much in proportion with the vegan/vegetarian population? I don't like the defeatist attitude that our choises as consumers don't matter, at all.

[-] SinAdjetivos@beehaw.org 2 points 2 years ago

It's not defeatist, it's pushing back against the wishful thinking that "voting with your dollar" is effective and your responsibility ends there.

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[-] java@beehaw.org 2 points 2 years ago
[-] fuzzywolf23@beehaw.org 2 points 2 years ago

It takes less land and water to feed someone wheat, soy or corn than to feed them beef, chicken or pork.

[-] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 2 years ago

what crops that are fed to beef chicken and pork are parts of plants that people won't eat for the most part. The same fields that grow the soybeans we use for oil are growing soybeans that are used as feed. The same soybeans that are used for oil are used for feed.

[-] fuzzywolf23@beehaw.org 2 points 2 years ago

This is sometimes true. However, e.g., about 4% of the farmland in California is used for alfafa, which is just for livestock. Alfafa is also a very water intensive crop.

Additionally, there are other uses that livestock corn feed could be put to if there weren't so many damn cows, so it's not like we'd be throwing away megatons of silage if it weren't for cattle.

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[-] commie@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

but beef, chicken, and pork continue to be made in increasing amounts. things are getting worse despite the fact that vegans exist. being vegan doesn't help the planet at all.

[-] fuzzywolf23@beehaw.org 1 points 2 years ago

World population increase + westernization of diets in China outweigh the tiny number of vegans in the western world. Your math doesn't check out.

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[-] shapesandstuff@feddit.de 5 points 2 years ago

I know, i am vegan for those reasons and more :)

this post was submitted on 16 Nov 2023
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