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this post was submitted on 17 Nov 2023
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politics
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No. Wernher von Braun was a brilliant scientist who worked for fascists, possibly under duress.
Musk is an idiot savant manchild taking the credit for the work of others and voluntarily cooperating with fascists and other bad actors to benefit his own ego and wallet.
Idiot (99%) savant (1%)
Yep and like Trump, the 1% savant lies in self-promotion and otherwise conning rubes, not anything that's useful to the world in any way.
I was speaking of the nazi aspects of them both.
And I was pointing out that Musk is no scientist and, unlike von Braun, we KNOW that he's working with the nazis and other fascists on purpose even though he doesn't have to.
You really think that he was working under duress with the nazis?
I don't know for sure, of course, but from what I've read about him it seems like he was just a scientist and harbored no fascist political views.
He wanted to build rockets for space exploration and was drafted into the war effort. The degree to which he was forced is unknown, but the nazis weren't exactlt known for their gentle methods of persuasion.
Given the scientists that made it out of Germany, it seems a little suspect, but I suppose we will never know for sure. I get wanting to pursue your life’s passion, but forced or not, he assisted one of the worst regimes this world has ever known and his knowledge directly lead to the deaths of many people. Ultimately does it really matter what he believed if through his actions he aided the nazis anyway?
Hell yeah it does! If von Braun had no ability to refuse, there's no fucking way he was anywhere near as bad as Musk.
Musk who's one of the richest and most powerful people in the world and as a result can do almost literally whatever he wants.
Musk who, despite widespread condemnation, continues to insist that it's not just okay to enable abuse and stochastic terrorism, it's his duty and makes him a hero of the people 🤦
No ability to refuse? Sure you don’t really believe that. We all have a choice, even if that choice is to end our lives, there is always a choice. He could have taken himself out, with as many of the scientists possible and set their program back years.
Are you really saying that him being responsible for the deaths of so many people due to German rockets still doesn’t make him as bad a musk? Really? Come on, musk is a fucking asshole but he has be directly involved with mass murder.
I had a whole thing ready but since you're apparently not operating on a very high level of understanding, I'll keep it relatively brief and simple:
Yes! OF COURSE it matters whether you have a choice or not and whether doing anything else is in your power!
As for direct involvement, Musk willingly and knowingly assisting the Chinese government censoring all mentions of their past and present atrocities while boosting the propaganda of known domestic terrorists is AT LEAST as direct as designing ordinance that the nazis then fired at a civilian.
Lol, you are funny. Have a nice day.
Eh Braun was in the party and never attempted to defect until his side had lost. He prioritized physics over politics sure, but he didn’t try to minimize the suffering his employers caused. At best he was an apolitical developer of arms for Nazi Germany who used concentration camp labor to do it.
How do you know?Did he ever have the opportunity to do so? The nazis probably kept him under 24/7 armed surveillance.
Same question.
No, at best he was a slave himself, just with more privileges. Like how in US chattel slavery house slaves had more privileges than field slaves but still had no freedom, rights or ability to make their own choices.
In contrast, Musk has all the rights, privileges and freedom in the world and he's voluntarily using it to aid fascists and other monsters while pretending that it's a heroic thing to do.
Because he had every reason to make all the claims he wanted and didn’t. Operation paperclip would’ve cleared his name if he had put up a reasonable farce of it.
And I know because a lot of researchers on the American side were German and Italian defectors who left when fascists started gaining power. Werner von Braun wouldn’t’ve been subject to quotas or anything like that as a leading rocket scientist.