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this post was submitted on 05 Jan 2024
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I would really advise everyone to read (or at least skim) South Africa's application to the ICJ for the genocide charges. It goes incredibly hard with specifics on quotes, actions, and just generally everything that clearly showcases the purposeful and active results of Netanyahu's government. They make it quite clear that nothing of what's happening or has happened was an accident and is being done without thinking or consideration.
And they bring all the references needed to back up their statements.
It says that no matter how horrible an act of war it cannot serve as justification for genocide. Can you detail how that's cringe?
Don't reply to rivermonster. Argues in bad faith and licks IDF boots super hard. Really don't bother. Every Israel thread is filled with his apologism.
I think it's important that people shoot him down using actual facts and reason, then otherwise ignore him. If it keeps just one ambivalent person from believing his lies, it's worth it. Propagandists like him rely on a lack of pushback to spread their lies.
True. It's important to respond not to him but to the people reading his propaganda. Also to educate them on how to refute other IDF propaganda.
It's pretty insane how many full on IDF trolls there are which are clearly not interested in changing their minds. Even Trump didn't have this many trolls to defend him outside of conserve echo chambers.
Oh, you know, I be hatin' I be callin' cringe
TLDR:
Condemns genocide, opening statement then disregards the attack (an act of genocide itself) by a group literally founded to commit genocide that caused the current conflict.
Long answer:
Sure, happy to: opening their genocide case by highlighting a genocidal attack by their allies (Hamas in this case), and then dismissing it. And only focusing on your allies' enemy for your argument that is alledgedly based on principal ; it both undermines the credibility of the failed state of SA and their argument.
This is a country that refused to arrest a criminal wanted for genocide.
Excusing your allies is contrary to arguing principal (in that a principal based argument isn't selective on whether you like Hamas and hate Israel). It's all sorts of super cringe and transparent what they're doing.
Hamas, their buddy, and worldnews' darling were literally founded on committing genocide. Their goal is to destroy Israel. Their foundation is a statement of genocidal intent. Their words.
In the end, it's all academic. The court can't do shit to Israel anymore than the failed state of SA can. ICJ and the ICC are as impotent as all the alt-left kids crying. In reality, this is most likely just propaganda and distraction from SA helping a criminal escape genocide charges.
Omar al-Bashir had warrants out for genocide, and SA refused to arrest him even though as signatories it was mandatory (back in 2015). They were fine with his crimes of genocide, but then again, he wasn't Israeli. LOL, they do NOT care about the principal.
To be fair, pretty much everything about the whole thing is cringe. It's just bait for the stupids and the gullibles.
Though it makes for a good laugh when you look at who the alt-left jumps into bed with.
Never thought I'd ever read someone call South Africa a Hamas ally.
Damn we really need to do something about this South African sharia regime. Gosh darn 1.5% Muslim population having country speaking out against my god ordained right to kill women and children.
Do your history homework. Originally strong ally to the PLO and Arafat and evolved into tight relations with Hamas.
Amazing, you just think genocide is justifiable. That's your cringe.
Can you detail the difference from those historical examples?
No. He cannot.
Ahhh! So, by your justification, if a group of people were to universally support a terrorist group (which the Palestinians don't), then that's justification to kill every single man, woman, and child in that group. It's justification to ask non-combatants to relocate to so-called "safe"areas, then to bomb those safe areas. By your criteria, every United States citizen is also deserving of death.
All your argument really shows is that you think genocide is acceptable under certain conditions (and that you're a terrible person).
What's your basis for repeatedly calling SA allies/friends of Hamas?
None other than Bibi's hand up his ass.
What is the alt left?
Imagine a violent, hateful maga person. Now put them on the left politically and make their focus anti-israel, anti-Jewish, or pro-Hamas. Give them blue Make Hamas Great Again baseball caps, if it helps.
So I have to imagine them? Lol
Yes 😅
Your description is an imaginary person. And your defense is to lash out. I bet you're stable and people like you.
Hey look, a straw man!
Agree. Especially pre-october.
But right now, the lines are blured. It's why anti-semtic incidents, attacks, vandalism, etc. have spiked since the terrorists attacked Israel. And rhe most incidents of all occur at the "pro-palestinan rallies", that turn pro-Hamas super easily.
Random selection for ya (pulled from Ground News high factuality sources, uses MBFC and a few others):
https://www.algemeiner.com/2023/11/28/horrifying-germany-registers-29-antisemitic-incidents-per-day-since-hamas-pogrom-in-israel/?utm_source=ground.news&utm_medium=referral
https://www.timesofisrael.com/watchdog-finds-unrwa-workers-praised-hamas-massacres-in-internal-telegram-channel/?utm_source=ground.news&utm_medium=referral
https://abc7chicago.com/hate-crime-chicago-police-department-israel-hamas/14055180/?utm_source=ground.news&utm_medium=referral
I'm all sorts of fine with condem atrocities and war crimes. I hate Bibi and Likud and would love to see the whole lot of them tried. And wewilli be on the same page up to Oct. I'm all for prosecuting collective punishment and other Israeli war crimes pre october. And every rocket fired at civilians was a war crime, and I'm for prosecuting the tens of thousands of those incidents. and other Hamas' greatest hits like suicide bombings and bus bombings.
The Palestinians have rejected 2-state 4 or 5 times, both pre and post. Roughly '37, '47, '67, '00, '08. And Israel has agreed to it multiple times and has been agreeable to it.. Go look it up. It's not hard to find. It's just a more inconvenient fact for Lemmy.
Also, dirty Jerusalem, which NOBODY should get. Since these fucking murderous religious trash of all varieties can't behave. They should just forbid it to everyone. Go kindergarten on them. "Now nobody gets to play with it". Much of the rejection of 2 state is fucking Jerusalem. Religion makes everything horrible.
And Palestinians DID elect Hamas, elected them to destrogy israel and the Jews. And they're more popular than ever. If they held elections today, they'd win easily both in Gaza and West Bank. Abbas is fucked and about to lose power completely.
Hamas is the government there. When people say aid to the Palestinians, what they mean is give money and food and fuel to Hamas (they literally handle it) amd then they also steal it and tell the citizens that Isreal is starving you. It'd great PR both in and outside of Gaza. It works wonders here eith Lemmy radical terrorist supporters and sympathizers.
Heh, all Arab states were established fairly recently. LOL.
And holy shit. At least we are done. You're an apologist for terrorists. As I tell a lot of radicalized kids on here who are Hamas aligned or members, you need to self reflect and get out of your bubble.
You're heading down a super dangerous direction that could ruin your life. Take a step back, and take a breath. And step away. When you come back, expose yourself to something other than Hamas propaganda, and the Lemmy echo chamber.
Your assertion that "Oct. 7th wasn't a terrorist attack", is a crazy huge red flag warning. I won't try to reason with you anymore. You're clearly past reason.
I wish you the best of luck and hope you turn away from embracing terroism before you become an active participant.
I've never seen a better recruiting place for Hamas than Lemmy. It's super dangerous, and needs to be addressed.
That's your response to a serious accusation of genocide? Pathetic.
I think genocide is not acceptable. I think the misuse of it by you and others is reprehensible and diminishes the term. I think you don't seem to know what genocide is or looks like. There are historical examples, and you could learn a lot.
There are lots of examples and I've studied them in university. They all look like what Isreal is preparing to do
Before the Serbs started the genocide of Bosnians, they were the subject of atrocious attacks by Bosnians. Look up the Green Berets or Salon Mahmuljin. The Serbs were also carrying the memory of the Ustasha genocide against them during WW2. They had a victim mentality, they felt their national survival was at stake and they had been brutally attacked. They then committed genocide.
The atrocities of October 7 have (tragically!) been eclipsed by the genocidal campaign that has followed them.
See also this: https://youtu.be/T8qGubNO_c0?si=qeZTSxx5WhqPr1vp
🔻