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this post was submitted on 03 Feb 2024
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I appreciate the sentiment, but calling October 7th a "holocaust" causes more problems than it solves. The Israeli propaganda machine has been active as soon as the attack started to make Hamas look worse than they already are (which is still pretty bad to be fair, but not "Holocaust" bad).
Thanks to Israel using people who weren't qualified for the job the numbers will never come to light, but let's not forget that a significant number of IDF civilians were killed by the IDF, not Hamas.
It seems like Israelis who disagree with Likud are completely in the propaganda. The "Holocaust" language seems to be their propaganda. To be fair, it was a massive attack that impacted pretty much every Israeli. With something that personal, it's easy to turn around and use the language of the people who are ultimately responsible for this attack in the first place.
Well there were no Israelis during WW2
What the fuck are you talking about? Likud undermined the peace process repeatedly and basically drove Hamas to attack, which is exactly what these folks are saying. Likud is also pushing this party line. The actual Holocaust wasn't in response to years of oppression. Using the "holocaust" language is antisemetic because it compares a horrific act of oppression to a horrific act in response to horrific oppression. These two should never be compared.
I'm talking about the fact that Israel didn't exist until 1948. I don't really care about the rest of it, but you seem to get it, so go on, spread the word.
What's an IDF civilian?
Oh shit my bad. I meant Israeli civilians.
Hamas committed genocide.
The Palestinian movement has failed to adequately separate itself from Hamas. No real denouncements of Hamas. You have people cosplaying as Hamas genocidal psychopaths at Pro-Palestine rallies.
Now the tactic seems to be to literally "both sides" genocide. Claim that Israel is committing genocide to provide cover for the genocide Hamas committed.
The old fascist tactic of accusing the other side of the things you're guilty of.
What's happening now is a war. A war that was started by the genocide Hamas committed. Given how Hamas has embedded itself into the civilian population, given that Hamas doesn't wear uniforms which would allow the IDF to distinguish combatants from civilians, given Hamas has made zero effort to protect the civilian population, building bunkers only for themselves... yeah it's a war with a lot of civilian casualties. A war Hamas started. A war Hamas created the conditions in which there would be high civilians casualties.
Anyone that's cracked open a history book knows what this is. People with foreign policy experience knows what's up.
But people reading the boosted Hamas propaganda have read the same lies over and over again enough times that they believe it.
Then scream on the internet about "why is Joe Biden allowing this to happen?"
It's because he's not in the information silo you're in. Hamas committed genocide. No matter how much people want to deny it, no matter all the "both sides" fascist narratives are spread on the internet, the truth is that Hamas committed genocide. Hamas started the war. Hamas set up the conditions for the war. As Hamas is being contained, the civilian casualties are dropping. Civilian casualties happen in Israel when Hamas is present. Civilian casualties also happen in Gaza when Hamas is present. Israel is not committing genocide because if that were the case, civilian casualties would increase where Hamas isn't present to protect them. But the opposite is happening. Civilian casualties are decreasing as Israel takes control of Gaza from Hamas.
You've been lied to. It's easier to convince someone of a lie than it is to convince them they've been lied to. It's not just the MAGAs that need deprogramming. There's a lot of people that fell for Hamas propaganda.
Yowza! That's a lot of easily disproven misinformation. You do realize you're on the Internet, right? You can actually look up the things you're claiming and verify they're not true.
Gish Gallop
Really telling on yourself here! Would be funny if you weren't so sad.
You must be paid well to write so much because everything after this was a total waste
nice thesis you got there.
They went into villages and massacred every man, woman and child they could find simply because they didn't approve of people of a certain ethnicity living where they did.
how did they gather so many hostages? if they massacred every man woman and child how can hostages be real?
you lost the plot. your thesis has no ground basis and is all feelings and nothing more. terror attack? yes. genocide? not even close.
at least you say hamas, and not palestinians.
Because you can take some people hostage while killing other people? It's not really that complicated.
Yeah because I'm consistently against hating people based on their ethnicity.
If this forum was dominated by people saying Palestinians are evil, I would be speaking out against that.
But this forum happens to be dominated be people promoting antisemitic conspiracy theories, and people that deny the existence of violence towards Jews. So I'm speaking out against that.
If you can see past the emotional manipulations that are happening in this particular information silo, you'll see the same pattern of behaviour I'm seeing. This forum is devolving into straight up antisemitism.
Criticizing the government and military of Israel is not anti Semitism anymore than calling out the American government is racism.
Rehashing the century old Protocols of the Elders of Zion shtick is antisemitism. And that kind of stuff has become mainstream now.
The closest thing I've seen to that is people wondering why the hell the Western world is supporting such an obvious genocide. And that's a fair question.
they didn't discriminate on ethnicity.
The whole point of Hamas is they're angry about Jews living in places that think Palestinians should living in. They went into villages that the believe should have only Palestinians living in and murdered every Jew they could find living there.
Maybe you've fallen sway to the blood and soil "river to the sea" narrative, but it's really just wanting a specific ethnicity living on certain patches of dirt and not wanting another ethnicity living there. Hamas has not been subtle about this. It's a fascist tendency we've seen many times before.
Hi. I have combat experience and foreign policy experience.
You're full of shit. This war is not to international standards. Israel has repeatedly failed to hold it's troops accountable for documented, credible accusations, of war crimes. That alone from a professional army is shocking. But on the policy side the IDF has a choice they refuse to make. They can let refugees out, deliver food aid themselves, or let the UN deliver food aid. They have decided to force people to remain in the combat zone and starve.
This is all well documented. It's not propaganda. And it is the conduct of a systemic genocide.