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this post was submitted on 21 Apr 2024
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UBI saves capitalism from itself. Do we really want to save this shit system that empowers the worst of us?
Do you honestly believe capitalists will allow a liveable UBI to remain untouched? Look at the minimum wage if you'd like to see the future of UBI. $7.25 an hour fucking shameful.
You're right we should do nothing instead and let people continue to starve.
I'll start. I'm not going to eat now.
I started yesterday. Take that capitalist. Can't make money of my continued existence if I'm not spending anything...
Bud, extreme change causes extreme strife. Having a system that allows us to transition from an old system that worked, to a new system that works better is the preffered method if you dont want to cause massive amounts of damage to peoples lives. The fact that UBI allows us to change towards a better way of functioning WITHOUT completely breaking the old system is a SELLING point. First we get people away from having to work merely to live, and THEN we can take further steps towards whichever utopic ideal we believe in
I mean it's not even really a first, if, then, kind of deal, because they're both mutually inclusive goals to be working towards, rather than being mutually exclusive.
If thats your utopic ideal, than our current system with a UBI baseline will reach it. This feels like a technicality you are arguing with me on
I mean no not really, I was just kinda advocating for dual power because people always like to make a big fuss about how it's their way ideologically or the highway, without stopping for five seconds about how a lot of people's ideal goals are actually mutually inclusive or mutually beneficial.
Thats exactly why I phrased my statement the way I did though, just focussing on how UBI is a good transitioning block away from our current capitalist society, without specifically getting into whatever flavour of utopic society each user might have. I guess if your ideal society has shitloads of unhoused people being crushed by late stage capitalism, UBI would work against that outcome
This program isn't UBI, and should not be compared to it, or used to argue for/against UBI. Universal Basic Income goes to everyone, not just certain people. That's what makes it UBI, and not a welfare program, which is what this is.
To reinforce your point:
Note that per a quick search Seattle has about 750k people, 102 specifically low income persons given money for some finite trial period is very very far from a test of universal basic income.
UBI will never go to everyone. Never.
This is like saying "a triangle will never have 3 sides".
UBI, UNIVERSAL Basic Income, goes to everyone by definition. If it doesn't go to everyone, it's not UBI, and shouldn't be called such.
Then we'll never be given UBI. You know... in the same way that we will never be given democracy despite everybody calling it "democracy."
Do you want the masses to have the material means to do anything other than bow to systemic pressure?
While I agree with your sentiment, I do feel like it is a step in the right direction and will help a great many people in poverty.
Going straight from one economic system to another is likely to be an extremely violent process. I'm hoping that this would act as a stepping stone towards socialism rather than a life preserver for capitalism.
How many times have you been forced to sleep out in the street?
“The proposed change isn’t perfect, so why bother at all?”