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(lemmy.world)
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this post was submitted on 20 May 2024
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What the fuck. That is NOT self-defense.
Yes it is
tit for tat is not a defense. he started it by getting out of the car to confront the man for no good reason.
So what? He was just supposed to continue having slurs hurled his way and not get upset about the fact?
Fuck out of here with that bullshit mindset
yes, it's called being the better man.
Be the better man and keep this opinion to yourself.
Sorry Mr Perfect not everyone has no breaking point, we'll send you in the next time we need someone to withstand torture though. fkn hell lol
a person subjected to racist slurs is by default the better man than the one hurling the racist slurs.
We've had over a decade of "when they go low, we go high" - how well has that worked? Maybe you've eaten too many vegetables amateurishly grown in contaminated backyards?
Lol dummy
dude just stfu
Talk shit, get hit. That's how free speech works. You can say whatever the hell you want but words have consequences and consequences can suck.
He got out of the truck because the guy was flipping out at him, and chose to use racist insults to provoke him. A simple proverb that could have helped that racist fuck: don't let your mouth write a check your ass can't cash ✨
that's not a good enough reason to get out and is just begging for trouble. it's extremely aggressive.
It actually is, there's a legal concept for fighting words that basically acknowledges you can't prosecute someone for getting provoked when the other guy was very obviously trying to provoke them.
Look out we've got a 1L here
Nah, just watch a lotta Legal Eagle
On that note:
If you can’t be prosecuted, it’s automatically a great idea.
Rude people should always be killed when there’s a valid legal pathway to doing so. No need to take a picture of the guy to post online or print and post on telephone poles, no need to tell your boss or call the cops - just meet the offender’s level of aggression up to and including violent acts that may lead to death.
Stop thinking, de-escalating, destressing: kill. They were mean first!
I didn't pick up on the /s for way too long...
If you matching the other's violence means you could kill him, it means he could've just as easily killed you first.
If you don't defend yourself in a situation where you could just die, you're incredibly stupid.
Fighting words have almost no meaning anymore, and it does not inherently prevent someone from being successfully prosecuted in all or even most cases.
Truck driver didn't throw the first punch, though. Extremely aggressive would be provoking someone with racial epithets and then proceeding to punch them when they pull over to respond.
responding was the bigger mistake IMO
Nah, the idiot went on too long without receiving consequences for his stupid mouth. People that say shit like that only say it because they think they can antagonize others without expecting anything in return. I imagine that guy had a long history of shit-talking, you don't spontaneously just become a racist fuckface with a loud mouth.
The fact he took the next step and punched the guy in the face--that's where he crossed the line, and all bets were off. He could have just apologized, run, or shut up but instead he chose to further escalate the situation that he started. At the end of the day, this isn't about being the "bigger man" or whatever it is you're trying to do to make the racist the good guy. Some people need to learn that you can't just go fucking with anyone you like without fear of retribution.
His parents would have done well to warn them of the dangers they might face by picking a fight with a stranger. Luckily, we can learn from his mistake and perhaps even share this tale with our loved ones so they too can catch themselves before they start hurting racial epithets at truck drivers, then proceeding to punch them in the face when confronted for their words. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
So he deserved to die?
He brought it on himself. Whether he deserved it or not is irrelevant
If I'm allergic to shellfish and decide to eat them anyway, did i deserve to die?
Look before you leap!
I'm not sure what I think about this. He probably deserved a punch, and no, you wouldn't deserve to die if you ate shellfish when allergic to shellfish.
I don't really think there's much difference here. When he decided to punch the truck driver, he invited a response. He was punched back. It's not the driver's fault the idiot couldn't take a punch. Do we know it was the driver's intent to kill the idiot? Should the idiot have warned the driver that he can't take a punch, therefore the driver is obligated to take his shit, accept a punch, and then walk away for the sake of being the "better man"? What precedent does that set? Racists are free to go about calling everyone whatever they want, start a fight, and because they might not be able to handle the repercussions, it will also be the responsibility of the victim of their verbal and physical assaults to then walk away just in case the racist can't take a punch?! What the fuck ever, man
I don't think you'd prosecute the guy for punching him, no.
Yes.
shouting at someone could be construed that way too, littledick
I'm a grower!
Eeeeh, no? The other guy was hurling racist remarks at him. He went to confront the guy. That is not starting it, that is following up.
Once the other guy delivered the first punch, the other guy started both the insults and the fight.
he was exercising his free speech rights and you think that deserves death?
when has that ever solved anything peacefully when the other person is yelling slurs? getting out of the car was the worst possible decision.
He was exercising his fREEEEEdom to fuck around and find out. Also throwing the first punch was the nail in the coffin, so to speak.
Freedom of speech is not freedom from speech bud, don't act like an asshole and not expect to be treated like an asshole.
... For which he should go to jail?
You know what a bad decision is? Yelling slurs and throwing hands when you know you arent in best health
You’re not wrong. I never understand the stupidity of escalating a confrontation when a perfectly valid method of avoiding it like walking or driving away exists. Someone calls you a bad name over and over so you have the choice of a) getting out of your vehicle and opening up all kinds of possibilities for shit to go wrong, or b) leave, and nothing else happens.
So this place is turning out to be just as bloodthirsty as Reddit, looking for fights instead of walking away and then saying FAFO as justification when someone dies. Life is so cheap for some.
finally someone on your server with a brain /s
I would have down voted this comment but it's at -69
It's not about self defense. As long as you match, and don't exceed the aggressor's energy, you're within your rights. If someone punches you, you can punch back but you can't pile drive the guy, but you can hit back just as hard.
The punch the FedEx driver threw wasn't meant to be fatal and was an acceptable retaliation after being verbally abused, then physically assaulted. It's not his fault the aggressor was glass Joe.
Agree, just a note: the verbal part was already assault. The physical part was battery, a separate offense that often isn’t required for a charge of simple assault. Any act that causes reasonable apprehension of harm is assault. Verbal threats with hate speech would easily qualify.
Info worth passing along I think, since many don’t realize physical contact is in fact the second criminal offense, and aggressive behavior itself is the first.
Ender in shambles.
Retaliation is not self-defense.
Retaliation has a meaning that does not have bearing here; mens rea for that cannot be established under the circumstances.
Level of reciprocity in force has always mattered; at least we're not under Hammurabi's anymore.
The prosecutor's office in the referenced discussion disagrees with you and you are making claims and not arguments.
That's not your definition of self-defense, but it fits many legal definitions. It says he left his vehicle to verbally challenge him. It also mentions he tried to deescalate via discussion:
He left his vehicle to discuss then the other man threw a punch, at which point he hit the guy back only only once. If someone is yelling and swearing at you, are you supposed to run? You can't even attempt to talk it out or you lose your right to self defense?
Unless you have been physically attacked or have a reasonable belief that you will be imminently attacked, physical violence is always unwarranted. Everyone arguing otherwise is a violent dumbass.
Cool so you agree that getting out of his vehicle to talk to the guy was alright, since there was no physical violence until the other individual threw the first punch.
Glad we got that straightened out.