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this post was submitted on 03 Aug 2023
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If you buy the hardware you should be able to turn it on. Jail breaking is fully moral in that situation.
The self driving is software that uses the hardware so should be paid for IMO. You should also be able to use your own software that’s open source on the hardware you own
Running your own software to control the automotive part of a car is probably not legal, since I assume the process of making a car street legal should requires an audit of said system.
Hmm, well, I hope it is the case, anyway.
Any software that passes whatever local safety standard should be installable (or software that doesn't pass if the car is not being used on public roads).
Otherwise the car is not being sold, it's being rented, and all the advertising that says anything about buying is fraud.
Good luck getting a homebrew OS for tesla cars to pass those tests. I don't even know how that would work. I'd be curious to know what would happen if you would try to register and get a car through the TÜV for example that runs on custom firmware.
The whole internet runs on a homebrew os.
What does that even mean and how is it relevant here? "The internet" isn't a car or piece of hardware.
Well-developed software built by professionals to industry standards and capable of doing a very important job effectively. And homebrew. You might be surprised at what sufficiently motivated nerds are capable of.
Im sorry, I still don't know what you're talking about. What about the internet runs on homebrew and how is it related to cars?
You might not understand what homebrew in a software sense is then full stop. Homebrew in software just means not commercially made/backed.
GNU/Linux and plenty of other open source projects that power your modern life and the internet started the same way.
Homebrew software is unofficial/non-commercial software for systems which were originally set up with proprietary software (like gaming console or in this case car OSs).
That’s the definition for games consoles specifically, I know you pulled it from wiki :)
Every computer that comes preinstalled with windows also falls under your definition though as does any Mac.
Linux was also developed for or spurned by a system that was proprietary and only for educational purposes MINIX.
It's similarly hard to make an airbag or seat belt, but you can still undo the bolt without the manufacturer in another country bricking your car without any considerations of your local laws.
What if your own self driving software causes an accident/death?
What if Teslas own self driving software causes an accident/death?
Tesla is subject to some oversight by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration. They recently forced a recall when they weren't satisfied with Tesla's software.
https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/tesla-recalls-362000-us-vehicles-over-full-self-driving-software-2023-02-16/
Maybe not ideal, but better than nothing I suppose. What oversight is a homebrew software alternative subject to?
Does Teslas still have a disclaimer that the self-driving features aren't self-driving and that if the driver is using the self driving features and there is an accident Tesla can't be held liable?
No idea, but I'd imagine so.
So it doesn't matter whatever you're using Teslas or a 3rd party software since you, as the driver, are responsible for the outcome.
If it was a matter of installing software on a laptop or phone, I'd agree with you, but installing software on a vehicle that can run over people is another matter, disclaimer or not.
Just like some cars are street legal and some cars are not, some software should be street legal and some software not. If the 3rd party software has been cleared by regulators for your Tesla, I'd be fine with it.
So you're claiming the software in Teslas have been tested and approved by the authorities?
You didn't read the article I linked? Seems they do it after the fact, which is sus imo, but authorities are exerting some level of oversight.
I did read it. They opened an investigation like 5 years after The Model S was released and people have died. Now, 6 years after that, something actually happens. 6 years of more accidents.
The same could be done with 3rd party software so there's no difference and it's not the same as the car system being regularly inspected.
I haven't followed it closely to know all the deets, but some action being taken is better than none. I'm not out here defending Tesla or current government policies. I do believe that if I have to pass a driving test to operate a vehicle, then whatever self-driving software is installed should do the same.
If you're trying to convince me that anyone should be able to take any random self driving software they found on the Internet, install it, and let it go wild on public streets, we're going to have to agree to disagree.
It seems you are trying to prove that "random software" is unsafe compared to Tesla's when you actually have no idea how safe Tesla's is.
There are multiple companies and universities developing software for self driving cars.
What if the "random software" was developed and maintained by Volvo, would you still call it "random software"? Would you still claim that Tesla's software is more safe to use?
Nope, if you look at a previous comment of mine in this thread, you'd see I'm fine with 3rd party software as long as it's been approved by regulators. Same goes for Tesla's software - if it hasn't been approved by regulators prior to deployment on the streets, I'm against it.
So you're not fine with Tesla's even?
Since there is no such testing you're talking about.