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the purpose of a system is what it does
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this post was submitted on 14 Aug 2024
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Solarpunk Urbanism
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A community to discuss solarpunk and other new and alternative urbanisms that seek to break away from our currently ecologically destructive urbanisms.
- Henri Lefebvre, The Right to the City — In brief, the right to the city is the right to the production of a city. The labor of a worker is the source of most of the value of a commodity that is expropriated by the owner. The worker, therefore, has a right to benefit from that value denied to them. In the same way, the urban citizen produces and reproduces the city through their own daily actions. However, the the city is expropriated from the urbanite by the rich and the state. The right to the city is therefore the right to appropriate the city by and for those who make and remake it.
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Well why don't all the blue states band together and make it happen? In fact why haven't they done it in the last 40 years or so? What's going on? What are they waiting for? They have power and money to make it happen. They supposedly even have political will? It's almost like it's all talk and nobody wants to do it
Sounds like a lame excuse for not doing the work. Why nobody requests it from their elected reps and city councils? Why nobody demands housing for homeless to be build in their neighborhood? Did you @SSJMarx petition your mayor to build something in your town?
So you reap the benefit of living in town that's presumably not overrun with visible homeless, but you seem fit to give advice to blue towns where I can't take my son to the park because of naked hobos running after us. That's not random example. This shit happens all the time.
You must be one of those people that climb mountains with no ropes. Good for you- doesn't work for everyone else. Especially women and children.
I was referring to you walking your dog among the hobos
Hey I'm all for building more affordable housing. I'm just pointing your that nothing official has been stopping this solution for decades, but nothing has been done to curb the problem. Articles like this don't address the reality of the situation. Articles like this is just a virtue signaling for the voter base. Everybody will node their little heads and move on with their day. The same people get elected and then ... nothing. Me and 90 percent of poor housed city dwellers will continue to suffer the consequences. Mark my word this is the issue that might turn blue city cores into red zones. Honestly Dems are just so lucky that Republicans screwed up with abortion rights otherwise they wouldn't have my votes either.
This is my question as well for a lot of issues and I think part of the answer must be that the democratic party as a whole just isn't that "left" when the rubber meets the road.
Another thing is that the places where democrats have overwhelming political majority is major cities more often than states. So you might get BLUE cities existing in just kinda blue states which exist in a country that is only half blue on a good day. The city, where the most political will to implement very left policies exists, is constrained in its actions by state and federal law and state and federal budgeting constraints which the city can't effect directly.
Because society as a whole has to tackle this. What do you think the red fuckers would do? They'd start shipping bussess of homeless people into blue states.
There needs to be a federal incentive structure. Don't want to take care of your homeless? No problem, no tax dollars for you, we're sending it to the blue states that are doing something.
Of course this would have to pass Congress and the red fuckers will never allow that to happen.
What? Why? Who gives a shit if you have 2x homeless instead of 1x homeless? Are you afraid to spend too much money? By calculations in this post we'd still be in the plus. Sounds like a bs excuse. Find another one.
Who cares? The tax payers will.
It doesn’t compute if half the country is sending the other half their homeless.
He’s right it takes everyone working together not half the country refusing to do anything but send people away and the other half having to find the funding.
Lol. Let me break it down for you since you apparently missed your math and logic classes. This article says that it costs 10k to house a hobo vs 30k to criminalize one. Blue and red states are about evenly split, so on average let's assume they have equal number of hobos. So even if all the hobos move to blue states, it will take 10k x 2 x OriginalNumberOfHobos which is still less that 30k x OriginalNumberOfHobos. So why are you denying this solution? Why are you cruel to poor homeless people? Not to mention that if it's successfully implemented, then red states will undoubtedly join in to save money
Yeah the article says 10k... I'm not sure where anyone could do it for that cheap.
And yeah your math sounds nice saying it's cheaper then the 30k but here's the reality. First you won't do it for 10k, that number is bs. Second think of all the homeless people in the US. Now multiple that by even just 10k. Exactly where is that money coming from, and remember it isn't a one time cost. It's every single year. The number would be staggering. It isn't feasible.
You really think red states would join? Yeah no they wouldn't. They'd send more, and laugh while doing it. While watching blue states economy crumble. Then when blue states economy is in shambles they're say "see this is why it doesn't work, vote red ".
I've personally seen what happens when an area builds a ton of low income and homeless shelters, while neighboring areas don't. The other areas literally send the low income and homeless people into the area that built the shelters. You can't build them fast enough. It fucks up the economy. Tons of resources being used and very little taxes being collected. The math doesn't add up.
The same would happen if blue states tried this. The red states would send the homeless and low income.
Chicago sent people to us on busses. No joke.
It takes all states taking the needed steps together.
So. Are you saying that the original article is bs and wishful thinking? Preaching to the choir buddy. I guess then the other solution of incarceration sounds more reasonable huh? Alternative of course is to do nothing and let everybody in the city suffer. That I'm sure is acceptable to you, but not to people who live here like me.
So in your brain you somehow went from me saying this is a financially a bad idea and somehow translates that into "that I'm sure is acceptable to you " that the current system is ok?
That is some serious delusion that you have going.
Actually your math didn't make sense man. I figured it's useless to point out so I just moved on to inevitable conclusion.
Ok let's try this a different way. Lemmy is definitely left leaning. And yet your comments in this thread are being down voted. I going out on a limb and saying even left leaning individuals who believe in doing things like this realize this won't work.
Well you don't have to convince me that most people here are clueless.
Spoken like a true child. You have failed to grasp the problem and you are obviously too ignorant to understand the solution. Grow up.
You're the child who doesn't have to deal with homeless every day. You make your make-believe world where this decades long conversation somehow solves the problem. Meanwhile we're overrun with then and just want peace. My family is not rich we can't afford to move, we can't afford private back yard. But we had to afford car because riding the Max after the second shift is too dangerous for my wife. What is your solution? Pay for everyone housing? Well then implement it. I beg you to do it. Why don't you?
Personal attack much? We have our reasons for living where we live. None of them is your business, but you really shouldn't be attacking me. I'm the victim here. I lived here long before hobo overrun. Why should I move? Why can't they move? Surely it's easier without any possessions. Am I less human then they are?
Good faith? Man, you must be tripping. What good faith do you expect? I keep voting for Democrats in hope that they fix this and they just don't. Every time just talk talk talk. I'm glad you got to signal your virtue and now you going to relax in your nice suburban house while I'm going to brave the horde of sundowners to pick up my kid from daycare.