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this post was submitted on 16 Sep 2024
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"It's wrong when they do it, it's okay if we do it."
Keeping a list of people openly putting out fascist paraphernalia is a good thing because people like this hide as soon as the wind turns against them. Don't let them fade into the background.
So...I'm with you. Fascists are bad, and we need to make sure that Fascists can't hide their fascism when and if we get this country sorted and back on its feet. But I have questions!
Liberals have a good reason for questioning your methods here. We don't want to become what we hate because when you stare into the abyss, the abyss stares into you. We've seen it happen time and time again. And those of us who look at your suggestion wonder if we will become Nazis trying to fight Nazis your way.
Its not my map
MAGAt Map is like Family Watchdog. It provides locations to avoid for safety.
The Ohio Sheriff is advocating lists for retribution and mob violence using a position of power.
I hope you can see the difference.
Read the other comments here, that map will be used for mob violence, too
Was https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Negro_Motorist_Green_Book used for violence? I'd say the benefit of providing safety is greater than the risk of bad actors.
Nah, I can't think of anything negative happening based on a list of people, their beliefs, and addresses especially not in the 1930s
Do you actually know what you're talking about? Do you have anything other than opinion and unsupported questions to offer?
I didn't ask a question, so there's that. Just a suggestion: maybe you should ask yourself how you will make sure that your map is not used for mob violence and how you can make sure that unvetted and outdated information doesn't hurt innocent people. Shitty ideas don't get better by good intentions.
You're right, my bad. I thought you had asked a question and when I reread I was wrong. Those are good questions. I still don't think this is a shitty idea with good intentions. It might just be a shit idea. Voting hasn't helped. Working with police hasn't help. Advocacy and protests haven't helped. Community hasn't helped. This is just another try.
Adding property records allows for a way to keep outdated information pruned. If the property sells, it can be removed.
Also, nothing on the website advocates violence or retaliation. Do you feel Family Watchdog should be taken down?
I'm sure the sheriff hasn't "advocated" for violence and retaliation either.
Reading the article, it's easy to see he has. Looking into his racist rhetoric, it's easy to see he has. Looking at his history... you guessed it!
What sounds more like a threat of violence:
Or
?
Oh, you're actually a full-on apologist. I thought you were trying for moral high ground.
Have a nice day and good luck on your future endeavors!
Sheriff suggests keeping a list of people who disagree with him politically.
Most people: "that's horrifying!"
You: furiously takes notes
Pointing out the obvious hypocrisy doesn't mean I'm defending anyone. Both of you are terrible people that no one should listen to.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Negro_Motorist_Green_Book
You've completely twisted the reality of what that book is. This was a guide on safe places, not your dystopian private citizen political tracker you're trying to promote.
You feel safe with fascists? Say, whats your address?
Does anyone here believe that these are equivalent, and that both of your statements are true?
it's a war. we're the good guys. glad you're catching on.
Said by everyone who has ever participated in a way.
sure, but only one side can win. which side do you want that to be?
The side that's not making a map of everyone who disagrees with them so that they can punish them as soon as they have the power to do so.
maybe you should leave the country then. i'm here to win because i care about what this planet looks like after i'm gone. there is no place for cowards any more.
I don't live in your third world country where the only way to beat fascism is with your own list of "undesirables" to purge as soon as you have the power to do so.
It's starting to look pretty faschy to me either way.
But to be clear: you're not calling for violence right?
for the record, i care about what happens to the planet. sometimes i say i don't for the sake of my own ego.
we've spoken before. i think you are a weak person with no solutions, content to allow the continual slide of our western society into dystopia. there is probably no reason for us to continue speaking as our values don't align.
You sure, you're against MAGA? You sound exactly like them
no i just realize that you have to fight back. in a war, both sides use weapons. are you going to throw water balloons because you don't want to be like your opponent? wise up.
Fight back ≠ maintain a list of everyone who expresses something I disagree with so I can punish them in the future.
says who?
It's not exactly "fighting back" when they're not fighting you now, and won't be fighting you in the future when you make use of your list.
but they are making lists. turnabout is fair play.
look, you've already made it abundantly clear that you are a weak pacifist, so i doubt you're going to make a point that has any influence over the way i think. that's why i mentioned that there's no point to us debating any of this. if our values don't align, you'll just be appealing to virtues that have no merit in my value system. do you understand what i'm saying?
Who exactly is they? You sure everyone in that list has a list in return? Or are you just throwing them all together because you're incapable of seeing shades of grey?
Yeah, because your value system aligns more with MAGAts than with us
you don't get to tell me what my value system is. it's mine. i don't have all day to explain how the world works to you.
no. my METHODS align more with them. my values are completely different. conservatives are the enemy. me thinks you enjoy virtue signaling more than effectively dismantling the current systems that produce suffering.
"I don't believe the same things they do, I just act in a way that is indistinguishable from them!"
"...Also the way they act is bad."
" It's okay when I do it though..."
How does your list effectively dismantle those systems? Because it sounds like the purpose of the list is for after you have "won" and will be used to create more suffering.
you've lost sight of the big picture and possibly never had it to begin with.
i am trying to bridge the gap to a world where we use science to better the lives of all living beings in sustainable ways. conservatives are the road block. i have solutions. you don't.
And what exactly are your solutions? I know step 1 is to maintain a list of everyone people accuse of being conservative, what is step 2? I wouldn't want to speculate and put words in your mouth.
Are the people you are putting on your list the ones making lists?
I agree that anyone who is actively making a list of people they disagree with politically, with the obvious threat of punishing those people in the future, should themselves be made public and their attempts at terrorism brought to light. This also includes you.
How is your list being vetted? What prevents someone from adding you to the MAGAt list?
Right, I'm so weak that I don't go away when you try to push me...
You're not having a private conversation here that I'm intruding on. You are posting publicly trying to sway other people's opinions, so I am going to reply pointing out how horrendous what you're arguing for is. I'm not trying to convince you, I'm providing a different argument to the people you are trying to convince.
If you want to try to defend your argument you are welcome to do so. If you want to live in an echo chamber of only people who agree with you, you are free to block me. Just be aware that I will still be pointing out the glaring flaws in arguments after you do.
oh sure. i get it. i reply to other people for the sake of a third party reader also. fair enough.
No one said otherwise, did you reply to the wrong comment? Or did you not bother reading the previous comment before replying to it?
You've made it very clear that you want the planet to not have anyone on it who disagrees with you, and that's okay as long as you believe you are the "good guys." That's a talking point straight out of Israel.
I have no idea who you are so I guess your arguments weren't very compelling then either.
Ad hominem does not discredit my points that your arguments sound the same as a fascist. If my argument is so "weak" it should be trivial to provide a counter argument.
If you're only interested in communicating in an echo chamber of people who agree with you maybe this isn't the right place for you.
You don't fucking "win" in any context of what your talking about. For every person who you "eradicate" of conservative thinking just makes the pendulum of thinking swing harder to resist what your attempting to do. You sound like a child or autistic. I haven't decided which yet.
i think people would cheer to see swaths of conservatives cease to exist.
That's....weird to say about your fellow countrymen. Like treasonous almost.
You should write that all over your car