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Child labor laws were enacted in the 1930s fyi, its not new for capitalists to use children. (lemmy.world)

submitted 1 year ago by Sgt_choke_n_stroke@lemmy.world to c/leftymemes@lemmy.dbzer0.com

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[-] drekly@lemmy.world 34 points 1 year ago

Do you have a version with less pixels please? I can almost read it

[-] Sgt_choke_n_stroke@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

I hope you can read this

[-] ConstantPain@lemmy.world 19 points 1 year ago

Waging should not be the concern of children in a first world country.

[-] Phegan@lemmy.world 19 points 1 year ago

Waging should not be the concern of children.

[-] ConstantPain@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

Fact.

[-] Peaty@sh.itjust.works 9 points 1 year ago

Children NOT being used for labor is a very recent phenomenon. It has nothing to do with the economic system of the country as the kids of rice farmers in Vietnam are harvesting rice just like the kids of rice farmers in North Carolina, USA are. Children not being used for labor is the results of automation and industrialization.

[-] the_post_of_tom_joad@sh.itjust.works 17 points 1 year ago

In the US it was actually the great depression that got a child labor law passed. there had been attempts to get something passed before, even attempts rooted in racism, but it wasn't until everyone was out of work that everyone could agree maybe only adults should be working

[-] Peaty@sh.itjust.works 3 points 1 year ago

Your username is amazing. Never doubt your greatness.

[-] Socsa@sh.itjust.works 9 points 1 year ago

Child labor is definitely not historically unique to capitalism, even in the modern era.

Stalin famously conscripted people into the labor reserve starting at 14 and the gulag system has plenty of history of child labor. And so on.

[-] Sgt_choke_n_stroke@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

What's the difference between prison and a gulag? The same difference between an oligarch and a billionaire

Edit: holy shit it's like arguing with Colin Robinson don't bother

[-] Socsa@sh.itjust.works -3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Im not really sure how that has anything to do with my comment. You can't dunk on capitalism for child labor and then be like "it's ok if Stalin does it because capitalism does it." That invalidates the original dunk, no?

[-] Sgt_choke_n_stroke@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

I don't know where you think I'm defending Stalin, I'm just pointing out, america uses juvenile detention centers for child labor as well. Gulags=prisons

[-] Socsa@sh.itjust.works -2 points 1 year ago

You are the one who made a meme about capitalism and child labor?

[-] doublejay1999@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

“Children should be free to earn their own money if they want to”

Liberals

[-] nexguy@lemmy.world 24 points 1 year ago

Weird since it was liberals who pushed child labor laws in the first place. No one thinks this is new to capitalism.

[+] Peaty@sh.itjust.works -6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Seriously in 3000 BCE millennia before capitalism there were kids laboring.

Edit: capitalism is not responsible for child labor. Child labor has existed for almost all of history until extremely recently and is not inherent to any system

[+] h3mlocke@lemm.ee 5 points 1 year ago

[deleted]

[-] Peaty@sh.itjust.works -1 points 1 year ago

My point is kids were doing labor way before any economic system was in place and regardless of which system was in place.

Capitalism has a ton of flaws but it is not behind child labor as OP suggests

[-] Nevoic@lemm.ee 5 points 1 year ago

This is fallacious. There doesn't have to be only 1 cause. Capitalism could be the reason child labor exists in the modern world, while there being other systems that can also support child labor.

The point is there are systems that don't support child labor.

[-] Peaty@sh.itjust.works 2 points 1 year ago

What systems do you think haven't supported or used child labor? Every single society has utilized child labor or still does as again farming is a thing and most farms will have kids doing some work.

The idea that child labor is due to an economic philosophy rather than specific conditions is fallacious. Kids labor because we need them to and they do not do labor when we are fortunate enough to not need the labor they can provide.

[-] Nevoic@lemm.ee 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

We don't have an accurate history of every society that has ever existed, so your claim is unverifiable. Don't make impossible to verify claims.

I wouldn't say a system supports child labor if it's outlawed and heavily punished. In the same way that I'd say a system doesn't support murder if it's outlawed and heavily punished. Sure, every society we know of has had murderers, and child laborers might exist in the same capacity in most societies, even if they're outlawed, but it's not supported by said system.

Also, my claim was that a system exists where child labor isn't allowed. Even if that system has never been put into practice (it definitely has, but just for the sake of argument), it's obviously true. Maybe you're unconcerned with hypothetical systems, and you're absolutely convinced that the only practical systems that can exist are ones where we rely on the labor of children to succeed. You'd be a fool if you believe that, but I understand some people are foolish.

[-] Peaty@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 year ago

We don't need an accurate history of every society to make my claim. We only need to know that farms exist and how farming works in the time before widespread industrialization and electrification.

The fact is at harvest everyone is working sunup to sunset as pre-outdoor lighting you need as many hands harvesting to get produce while it is ripe so you limit loss to rot and pests. That means throughout history kids were working on the farm for AT LEAST harvest (realistically it is safe to presume they worked much of the year).

As every society needs food you should not be surprised to discover every single one has some degree of child labor.

So what system doesn't involve child labor? And why us child labor a product of economic ideology when every single system has involved some degree of child labor?

Let's not start calling people fools as right now you are making a very bold claim that is easily dismissed by anyone who worked a farm

[-] Nevoic@lemm.ee 1 points 1 year ago

Your claim was that every single society had used child labor, that's unverifiable. You claim that you know this because every society requires food, picked by kids instead of adults.

What's actually really cool is that adults can also pick food in a farm, it's not a job exclusive to kids. You might be surprised to learn that the vast majoriry of farmers in the world are actually adults.

Society doesn't need child labor to survive. More labor helps during times of hardship, but we can just send the capitalists to work instead of having them force the children to do it.

[-] WarmSoda@lemm.ee 1 points 1 year ago

What systems are those?

[-] Socsa@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 year ago

I mean even from the most obnoxious campist perspective, both the USSR and communist China have plenty of documented examples of Child labor which are arguably worse than anything in the US.

[-] SnipingNinja@slrpnk.net 1 points 1 year ago

Read the comment you're replying to again?

[-] WarmSoda@lemm.ee -4 points 1 year ago

This is the dumbest take I've seen in a while.
You seriously think liberals and capitalism are the only things that used child labor? Lol

[-] user_AW11@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

Please consider this:

"lemonade stands" don't occur in other countries.

[-] HolyDiver@lemmy.world 9 points 1 year ago

they do though, but lemonade stands aren’t really child labour

[-] nexguy@lemmy.world 14 points 1 year ago

They are usually for fun and no one makes them do it and they are not doing it to put food on the table. It's like playing grownup for them.

[-] MNByChoice@midwest.social 3 points 1 year ago

for fun

Yeah. Even the adults are playing. (Please give adults and easy way to dump the lemonade. Often, we don't actually want to drink it.)

[-] 1847953620@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

I always thought they were actually cringey.

this post was submitted on 05 Oct 2023

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