Eh. Billionaires are each directly responsible for meteoric contributions to human suffering and loss of life. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to dismiss the humanity of folks who actively devalue the humanity of the vast majority of humans. Eat the rich.
I think it's unreasonable and a huge generalization. Tell me what the 19 year old billionaires son did to contribute to human suffering.
I appreciate your voice and the importance of the sentiment that all humans deserve fundamental dignity and respect.
That said, “all billionaires are malfeasant parasites who don’t deserve to participate in society” is a hill upon which I’m willing to die.
It takes a special kind of sociopathy to pillage and hoard resources unfathomable when people are starving, suffering, and dying.
“Eat the rich” is more stirring and concise than “humanely strip the heinously wealthy of their power and resources”.
I'm all for eating the rich. Never in my comment did I say I think that billionaires got their money by being kind.
The only way to have that money is to cause the death or at least loss of "life" (eg. Wage slavery, lobbying for less socal welfare while making sure you get all the tax cuts, ect.).
What I am saying is, at the end of the day, being angry at dead people won't help anyone that they hurt.
How many people died in car accidents, and from preventable disease, every day of the coverage?
I only have so many fucks to give and I'm not wasting them on some spoiled thrill seeker.
That's a strawman argument. No one is saying "I'm glad the son who didn't want to go on the boat died."
I do feel sympathy for the human lives lost, at the end of the day, they were still human. On the other hand, people are allowed to feel whatever they want.
Up until it was confirmed they died, I was on the side of "Fuck um', they're stupid act cost millions of tax dollars that they lobby to pay as little as possible into." But after it was confirmed, I still can hate billionaires, but I am now directing my anger at the CEO who bypassed all regulation to make money and took five innocent people with him.
The moments before the implosion were something that no one should ever need to feel in their lives.
(That being said, who tf unquestionably enters a vessel where you need to be bolted in from the outside and there is no emergency exit.)
The moments before the implosion were something that no one should ever need to feel in their lives.
Just to this point - it would have happened too fast for them to even register anything was happening. Complete destruction would occur in 1/20th of a second. (Per Insider/Naval History Magazine)
I mean, billionaires also trend towards the ghoulish, so maybe it's appropriate?
I'd go as far as to say that it's not a trend, it's a prerequisite.
disgust at the vast hoarding of wealth and suffering caused by billionaires is one thing, but openly revelling in their death is gross and i wish more people would say it. it often feels like people have a streak of sadism that they want to direct at an "acceptable" target through bloody revolution, rather than being leftist because of compassion for other living beings
I just honestly didn't give a shit about them, and still it was all over the news.
How many people died in car crashes eachday this coverage was everywhere?
A group of rich people with poor research skills exploded themselves, and it just doesn't matter to me.
We don't spend half this time crying over much bigger tragedies.
I reckon that people become leftists out of compassion, but the dehumanizing rhetoric seems cool and edgy; so they slide into it, thinking it’s OK.
Hate systems, not people. Don’t eat the rich, eat their money.
Systems exist because people willfully build and maintain them. Extreme wealth inequality is not the result of an accident. It is very much by design.
I think that years of struggle just to meet basic needs leads to dangerous anger, resentment, and bitterness. Tbh billionaires are the ones who have rigged the system against us with decades of lobbying and most, if not all of them, would gladly see us dead in a cost benefit analysis if it gained them profit, so I have no problem with people taking pleasure in their misfortune. They made their choices and current public opinion is the consequence of that. No one gets to and stays at billionaire status off of pure merit alone...
It is difficult to have compassion for those who utterly lack it.
Ignoring the fact that some of these people were billionaires, I think all of them forfeited any respect for their lives when they chose to step into a metal tube and put several miles of water between them and the breathable atmosphere, for fun. Same as mountaineers choosing to climb into a "death zone". If you choose to go there for fun then that's how much YOU value your own life and your relationships. I don't see why I should then have a huge amount of sympathy when these people inevitably die.
I cannot understand why the military was mobilised at huge cost? Surely these people should sign a much more wide ranging waiver saying they are doing this at their own risk and should not expect any rescue attempts beyond what the organisers insurance policy covers?
This viewpoint is misguided and inhumane, I'm sorry to say. We don't get to pick and choose who's lives have value, even if they do something risky or stupid.
I don’t see why I should then have a huge amount of sympathy when these people inevitably die.
Ugh
I think there's a difference between choosing whose lives have value and choosing who to empathize with. I'm not celebrating their deaths, but aside from the teen who was on there, I can't say I feel much about it one way or another. They knowingly chose to take the risk, signing waivers saying that they knew the trip could result in death, and it ended badly.
Looking at it from a different angle, I can also see why people would be frustrated that an incredible amount of attention and resources are being spent on people who intentionally put themselves at risk for a pleasure jaunt, while if a fraction of that (on a per capita level) was spent on everyone who was at risk of dying from issues brought on or exacerbated by poverty, we'd be saving a lot of lives.
We don't get to pick and choose who's lives have value, even if they do something risky or stupid.
But isn't that exactly what happens? Was there as much of a rescue effort to find the hundreds of missing Pakistani migrants who went missing off the coast of Greece last week? Was it even as widely covered in the media as 5 missing rich people in a sub? Have you even heard that they were missing before this comment?
What about the 5,000 missing and murdered indigenous women who disappear every year? Are we mobilizing the military to find them?
We absolutely pick and choose whose lives have value. That's the problem.
We'll be sure to let the U.S. Coast Guard know about their lackluster presence in the Mediterranean Sea
Have you even heard that they were missing before this comment?
How could anyone who's been on beehaw in the last few days not have heard about the Pakistani migrants?
How could anyone in this thread not have heard?
We absolutely pick and choose whose lives have value.
I don't know who you mean when you say "we". If you mean governments and power structures then yes, I agree and it's one of the biggest flaws in our society. If you mean individuals, then yes, some people do, but it's wrong to do so whether it's billionaires, migrants, or anyone else. And I know a lot of people have a hard time with this.
We have to choose where to spend the limited material and human resources we have.
These people made their own bed. Those rescue resources were wasted on them. Don'tkird yourself that poor people in a boat accident would've got a 10th of that attention.
The US military spends 2 trillion a year. I'd much rather see those resources go into rescue operations than the opposite. Poor people in a boat should absolutely get access to the same resources, and the crime here is not that billionaires did, but that the migrants didn't.
These weren't people on the job, or people doing anything remotely necessary. This was a joy trip for spoiled richies, and I don't see any justification for spending societal effort on it.
Not to mention rescue was most likely doomed from the start considering how far beyond the depth of any successful rescue, ever, that this was.
We don’t get to pick and choose who’s lives have value
Lol, on an individual basis, yes we do
Fair, let me amend...
We don't get to pick who's lives have value unless we want to be hypocrites and no better than "them"
I cannot understand why the military was mobilised at huge cost?
I thought this at first. However, it was the Coast Gaurd who was doing a lot of the rescue operation. Rescuing people from their bad boating decisions is most of what the Coast Gaurd does - if we don't want to pay for it then we'd need to disband the Coast Gaurd. The only options were for us to pay for them to sit and watch or pay for them to try to help. At least they got more experience with these sort of rescues by trying to help.
I remember years ago a bunch of people were bitching about the cost when some family that got rescued in the middle of the ocean. The coast guard response to the money complaints was,"Look, if we weren't rescuing them, we would be running drills to prepare to rescue them at the same cost."
That is the one good thing that comes out of this. Lot of really good training. Something might come out of the investigation though these guys probably violated so many standard practices that may have little value.
It's like when people bitch about having fighter jets fly over a baseball game. We don't rent F-16s from Lockheed every time we want to take one out, they're paid for already, and pilots need training. But I'm sure they're the same kind of people who don't understand why it's useful for military pilots to run drills on things like being in a specific place at a specific speed and making it line up at the exact right time. I say complain all you want about glorification of the military-industrial complex, but don't take the line that it's some atypically expensive cost to the taxpayer.
I think all of them forfeited any respect for their lives when they chose to step into a metal tube and put several miles of water between them and the breathable atmosphere, for fun.
Sure, I think it's maybe fair to say that about ceo, who cut all sorts of corners with the construction (and it was a carbon fiber tube, not metal, which was the main problem)
However, the 19 year old kid on board was dragged along by his dad, and was reportedly terrified and didn't want to go. I think it shows an extreme lack of empathy to say his life had no value because of the situation he was put in.
Thousands of people step into a metal tube and put several miles of air between them and the ground on a daily basis. Some of them do it for fun, or at least in order to travel to the place where they plan to have fun.
That's not the problem. The problem is that those metal tubes are competently engineered. Usually.
The way I see it Stockton Rush conned them onto that boat, I might not like these people as people, but I don't put blame on them they probably should have done more research but we all sometimes jump into something without much, they probably assumed that because deep sea submersibles are a mature technology at this point with a pretty damn good safety record considering what it is that it would likely be fine.
He refused to allow non destructive testing of the Hull before and after dives or even on completion/delivery of the hull and relied on sensors to alert him to issues with the hull. Considering the relatively low cost of non destructive testing of composites it's wildly negligent.
Actually think it was a plastic tube. Carbon fiber and resin maybe.
Death clocks are ghoulish. Dethklok, however, is AWESOME.
Dr. Rockzo, on the other hand, terrifies me.
Go into the water, live there, die there.
Took Dethklok too literally I guess?
What anyone chooses to spend their money on. Is none of my business.
How they earn it and what share of taxation they face, really is the only debate any of us should feel entitled to.
I do agree that they are pretty awful. I feel very little sympathy for the rich getting themselves killed doing stupid rich people stuff, but celebrating their death is still in poor taste.
Celebrate their deaths like you would the death of your skin cells. Forget about it.
Eh people like that CEO with his libertarian view of safety regulations actively hurt all of society, often to their own benefit. Them getting taken down by their own bullshit is unequivocally a boon to the masses. I can see not supporting celebrating their undoing but I don't think we should be reprimanding those who do celebrate
people like that CEO with his libertarian view of safety regulations actively hurt all of society
Sometimes, those views just sort of have a way of imploding.
For sure. Their passing is likely overall objectively good for humanity. By at least a little bit.
Are we talking about eating the rich? I'm hungry.
beehaw: the enlightened platform where you can dehumanize people as long as youre polite and well-spoken about it
May your mother go fornicate herself with great pleasure my good sir
Most humans do that on a regular basis, so I'm not sure how that's supposed to be dehumanizing.
Hard to give a toss about most of them, they knew what they were getting into and it seems like the entire submersible community tried to warn against it, but such was ignored and disregarded as established interests stifling 'innovation'.
But I feel really bad for Suleman Dawood. He was just a kid, and was -- seemingly wiser than the rest of them -- rightly terrified of this aquatic death machine. A lot of people, especially in the media, have tried to make light of their collective, violent end, suggesting it should be some consolation that it would've been over before they knew anything was wrong, Except according those most informed on the situation, stubborn owner aside, those onboard seemed to be entirely aware something was wrong. (Why else would they have been trying to surface?) Really sucks that a teennager got roped into this stupidity on account of his Titanic-obsessed dad.
Gallows humour is to be expected with these things, but finding out about Suleman left me utterly depressed. Perhaps it's wrong to direct my irritation thus, but I felt particularly disgusted at someone who casted things as somehow beautiful for a father and son to die together, as though creating a deep, spiritual bond between them in the afterlife. So much media mindlessly lumping him in with his father's motivations as though he was a fellow extreme tourism enthusiast, rather than a scared kid simply looking to his father for validation.
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