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So state-capitalism is socialism? (lemmy.ml)
submitted 4 hours ago by Confidant6198@lemmy.ml to c/communism@lemmygrad.ml
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Source: https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1917/ichtci/11.htm

Full pamphlet (Marxists.org): https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1917/ichtci/index.htm

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[-] yogthos@lemmygrad.ml 8 points 1 hour ago

Basically it's a stage of development where the dictatorship of the proletariat has been established, but the existing capitalist relations have not yet been abolished. This is a good explanation of what socialism means in Marxist terms. https://www.versobooks.com/blogs/3228-lenin-s-three-theoretical-arguments-about-the-dictatorship-of-the-proletariat

[-] RedWizard@hexbear.net 2 points 2 hours ago

Socialism is the transitional phase between capitalism and communism. In places like Russia at the time of their revolution they did not have an industrial base when compared to places like Europe. There was still peasant farming for example. The NEP was Lenin's attempt to build that base. Similar lessons were learned in China.

[-] cfgaussian@lemmygrad.ml 10 points 3 hours ago

It is more accurate to say that socialism is "state capitalism" under the dictatorship of the proletariat.

[-] darkernations@lemmygrad.ml 1 points 6 minutes ago

It is more accurate to say that socialism is “state capitalism” under the dictatorship of the proletariat.

I like the term with the qualifier you mentioned because it forces marxists to consider the dialectics of what it means to build socialism.

[-] davel@lemmygrad.ml 6 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago)

I think it was a mistake to have coined the term “state capitalism” in the first place. By Marxism’s own meaning of “state” and Marxism’s own meaning of “capitalism,” “state capitalism” is an oxymoron. Whatever Lenin meant by it, it must have been something different from the sum of its parts, and all that has accomplished is confusion.

States, as the creators of money by fiat, are not animated by the M-C-M’ motive. They introduce arbitrary amounts of M into the economy by spending it into existence.

[-] cfgaussian@lemmygrad.ml 4 points 2 hours ago

I agree, it's a misleading term.

[-] amemorablename@lemmygrad.ml 3 points 2 hours ago

I wonder, is the original quote even in English or in Russian? Because if it's in Russian originally, the translation could have messed up on the equivalent meaning in Russian somehow, causing it to seem more confusing than intended.

this post was submitted on 13 Dec 2025
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