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;DR blame the dev (programming.dev)

Post:

If you’re still shipping load‑bearing code in C, C++, Python, or vanilla JavaScript in 2025, you’re gambling with house money and calling it “experience.”

As systems scale, untyped or foot‑gun‑heavy languages don’t just get harder to work with—they hit a complexity cliff. Every new feature is another chance for a runtime type error or a memory bug to land in prod. Now layer LLM‑generated glue code on top of that. More code, more surface area, less anyone truly understands. In that world, “we’ll catch it in tests” is wishful thinking, not a strategy.

We don’t live in 1998 anymore. We have languages that:

  • Make whole classes of bugs unrepresentable (Rust, TypeScript)
  • Give you memory safety and concurrency sanity by default (Rust, Go)
  • Provide static structure that both humans and LLMs can lean on as guardrails, not red tape

At this point, choosing C/C++ for safety‑critical paths, or dynamic languages for the core of a large system, isn’t just “old school.” It’s negligence with better marketing.

Use Rust, Go, or TypeScript for anything that actually matters. Use Python/JS at the edges, for scripts and prototypes.

For production, load‑bearing paths in 2025 and beyond, anything else is you saying, out loud:

“I’m okay with avoidable runtime failures and undefined behavior in my critical systems.”

Are you?

Comment:

Nonsense. If your code has reached the point of unmaintainable complexity, then blame the author, not the language.

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[-] jonathan7luke@lemmy.zip 120 points 4 days ago

I'm not even going to bother commenting on that train wreck of a post, but I just wanted to mention that I hate the writing style of programming-related LinkedIn posts. They're just chock-full of sweeping generalizations presented as absolute truth in an extremely patronizing tone.

Why can't people just say, "In my opinion, X technology is a better fit for Y situation for Z reason," instead of "Every time you encounter X, you must do Y, otherwise you're dead wrong."

It's just simultaneously so arrogant and also aggressively ignorant. If someone spoke to me like that in real life, I would never want to speak with them again. And these people are broadcasting this shit to their entire professional network.

[-] Ephera@lemmy.ml 29 points 4 days ago

Yeah, particularly the broadcasting really irks me.
That is an opinion you can hold for yourself and then make compromises as you encounter reality. I do expect programmers to hold strong opinions.

But when you broadcast it, you strip yourself of the option to make compromises. You're just saying something which is going to be wrong in one way or another in most situations. I do expect programmers to be smarter than that.

[-] ExLisper@lemmy.curiana.net 63 points 4 days ago

Just don't do bugs. How hard is that?

[-] douglasg14b@lemmy.world 12 points 3 days ago

According to all teams I've worked on.

Pretty fucking hard.

I know this is satire, But really though better languages that make various classes of defects unrepresentable reduce defects. It's wild that such a statement needs to be made, but our industry is filled with folks who don't critically think about decisions like these.

[-] MIDItheKID@lemmy.world 11 points 4 days ago

Like the age old advice for getting better at Smash Brothers - Don't get hit.

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[-] pelya@lemmy.world 36 points 4 days ago

TypeScript and safety-critical paths should not be in one sentence.

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[-] Shirasho@lemmings.world 105 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

"Blame the author, not the language"

Says the person who screams they have never worked professionally with a team before.

There is no excuse to not use statically typed, safe languages nowadays. There are languages that let you build faster like Python and Typescript, but faster does not mean safer. Even if your code is flawless it still isn't safe because all it takes is a single flawed line of code. The more bug vectors you remove the better the language is.

[-] Arkouda@lemmy.ca 69 points 4 days ago

Even if your code is flawless it still isn’t safe because all it takes is a single flawed line of code.

If there is a single flawed line of code, the code isn't flawless.

[-] homoludens@feddit.org 15 points 4 days ago

Even if the code is flawless now, all it takes is a single flawed line of new code. This is of course true for all languages, but type safety helps a lot as some types of flaws would not compile.

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[-] rtxn@lemmy.world 37 points 4 days ago

let you build faster like Python

I have to write so much boilerplate code to make sure my objects are of the correct type and have the required attributes! Every time I write an extension for Blender that uses context access, I have to make sure that the context is correct, that the context has the proper accessor attributes (which may not be present in some contexts), that the active datablock is not None, that the active datablock's data type (with respect to Blender, not Python) is correct, that the active datablock's data is not None... either all that or let the exception fall through the stack and catch it at the last moment with a bare except and a generic error message.

I used to think that static typing was an obstacle. Now I'm burning in the isinstance/hasattr/getattr/setattr hell.

[-] reabsorbthelight@lemmy.world 22 points 4 days ago

I loved python when I was a junior dev. Now I hate it (except for things like computational math). I have to add debug statements to figure out that someone snuck in the wrong type into the code.

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[-] BassTurd@lemmy.world 37 points 4 days ago

There are definitely use cases where something like C is still the best option because it's faster. For the most part consumer software it's unnecessary, but it's not obsolete for all applications.

[-] SpaceNoodle@lemmy.world 35 points 4 days ago

Hell, assembly code is still necessary for the lowest-level init code. Once you have a functional stack and some var init logic you can graduate to C.

[-] AnarchoSnowPlow@midwest.social 37 points 4 days ago

That's ridiculous. Everyone knows its best to write modern bootloaders in Matlab.

[-] rainwall@piefed.social 22 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

You joke, but my first "lets make facebook, but..." comment was from an electrical engineer buddy that wanted to use matlab. That was the whole pitch. "Facebook, but matlab."

It did not go far.

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[-] affenlehrer@feddit.org 23 points 4 days ago

In my 15+ years of experience many of the actual field problems are not language / programming related at all. Unclear requirements or clear but stupid requirements cause loads of issues. These are often caused by communication problems between people and / or organizational issues.

It depends a lot on the industry of course. For embedded software, low level networking etc I mostly agree with you. However, in business applications or desktop applications it's from my experience mostly bad requirements / communication.

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[-] Scrath@lemmy.dbzer0.com 65 points 4 days ago

As an embedded dev, good luck not using C

[-] Strawberry@lemmy.blahaj.zone 15 points 4 days ago

Not an embedded dev. What's the Rust situation in the embedded world? Is it ever used?

[-] Ephera@lemmy.ml 19 points 4 days ago

In my corner of the embedded world, it feels like everyone is practically jumping to integrate Rust. In the sense that vendors which haven't had to innovate for 10+ years will suddenly publish a Rust API out of the blue. And I'm saying "out of the blue", but I do also regularly hear from other devs, that they've been pestering the vendors to provide a Rust API or even started writing own wrappers for their C APIs.

And while it's certainly a factor that Rust is good, in my experience they generally just want to get away from C. Even our management is well aware that C is a liability.

I guess, I should add that while I say "jumping", this is the embedded world where everything moves extremely slowly, so we're talking about a multi-year jump. In our field, you need to get certifications for your toolchain and code quality, for example, so lots of work is necessary to formalize all of that.

[-] BartyDeCanter@lemmy.sdf.org 16 points 4 days ago

I've been an embedded developer for coming up on 20 years at this point, and recently went through a job hunt. Of the three that made it to the offer stage, two used Rust almost exclusively in their embedded stack and one used Rust in their embedded LInux stack and was trying to decide if they were going to use rust in their bare-metal/RTOS stack. I ended up at on of the Rust places, though I had no Rust experience. I have to say, while I do find many parts of the syntax too cute by half, in general I'm pretty happy with it as an embedded language. My current target architectures are ARM Cortex-M7 and Cortex-A53. In general toolchain, and debugger support has been good, peripheral support has been ok but could use improvement.

[-] Flipper@feddit.org 19 points 4 days ago

It's not widely used. Some car manufacturers(Toyota if I remember correctly) have started testing it. Some parts are really nice.

There is exactly one hal for i2c, spi and Io pins. As long as both your chip and peripheral driver implement against it, it just works. There are more unified abstractions in the work for things like DMA, but they are not officially stable yet.

Cooperative Multi threading can easily be integrated thanks to Async rust and executors like embassy.

All the crates that are no_std compatible can be included.

It's not perfect, but it's getting there.

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[-] grue@lemmy.world 76 points 4 days ago

Python isn't "untyped;" it is, in fact, strongly-typed. (And is markedly different than and superior to JavaScript on that point.)

This rant feels like it was written by an OO programmer who was never able to wrap his head around functional programming.

[-] Badabinski@kbin.earth 37 points 4 days ago

Yeah, plus it has type hints and tooling to make said type hints mandatory.

Also, like, fuck golang, it's such a shit language and the compiler does very little to protect you. I'd say that mypy does a better job of giving you AOT protection.

[-] qaz@lemmy.world 19 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

Also, like, fuck golang, it’s such a shit language and the compiler does very little to protect you

I never understood why people like it. It's a "new" language, and it still doesn't seem to get the basics right. No proper null handling, and don't get me started on interface{}. It's like they set out to build a better alternative to C++ while ignoring the other developments outside C/C++ for the past 15 years. The compiler is damn quick, though.

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[-] echodot@feddit.uk 19 points 3 days ago

So there is apparently a problem with languages such as JavaScript and the solution is to use languages such as TypeScript.

Wut?

[-] keegomatic@lemmy.world 11 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

Well, yes. TypeScript mitigates one big problem with JavaScript (type safety). That’s why it exists. It’s a dumb idea to choose vanilla JS over TS if you’re starting a new project today, IMO.

Whether or not you should use TS as your core language is debatable and situational, but in terms of using TS instead of JS, yeah, that’s a no brainer.

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[-] Zos_Kia@lemmynsfw.com 42 points 4 days ago

it's just negligence with better marketing

Good damn I hate that tone it reeks of LinkedIn llm-powered personal branding. Weak ideas with writing that tries to sound strong is the worst.

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[-] sheepishly@fedia.io 22 points 4 days ago

don't just m-dash

chat gippity

[-] chatokun@lemmy.dbzer0.com 17 points 4 days ago

Maybe, but always remember LLMs are trained on real people. Some people naturally use similar styles to some LLM tica as it was stolen from them in the first place.

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[-] Ashelyn@lemmy.blahaj.zone 9 points 4 days ago

Don't just state—regurgitate!

[-] bleistift2@sopuli.xyz 55 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

I agree with the post. Setting up typescript takes an hour or two if you have no clue what you’re doing. In return you get the absence of (the equivalent of) null pointer exceptions.

I chuckle every time I find an NPE in the Java backend. Doesn’t happen to me. Can’t happen to me.

Sidenote, while I’m already gloating: Once the backend code had an error where they were comparing two different kinds of IDs (think, user ID and SSN), which gave wrong results. This error can’t happen to me either, because I type my IDs such that they are not comparable. A strong type system really is a godsend.

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[-] Bane_Killgrind@lemmy.dbzer0.com 35 points 4 days ago

Nonsense. If your code has reached the point of unmaintainable complexity, then blame the author, not the language.

I feel like there's about one person that can cast this stone, and that's because preventing this has turns Torvalds into an abusive bridge troll sometimes, but he's actually been successful.

[-] bleistift2@sopuli.xyz 16 points 4 days ago

Well, the kernel is unmaintainably complex. Linux saves his sanity by not looking deeply into modules and only inspecting the surfaces.

[-] Atlas_@lemmy.world 21 points 4 days ago

Go and Python and Typescript all have their own footguns.

I assume Rust is the same, but haven't used it personally to see

[-] danhab99@programming.dev 17 points 4 days ago

Rust is the foot gun, it's so perfect that you genuinely cannot just sit down and type out what you need.

[-] fnrir@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

Skill issue

- sincerely, someone making a DST crate

EDIT: To clarify...

There are some things that are only doable on nightly Rust (like specialization, const fn in traits, etc.) and the reason for that is to avoid future issues. In that regard, Rust will not be as good as C++... at least until those get stabilized.

Some of the nightly functionality (like ptr_metadata) can be achieved with unsafe code and it's fine to do that, as long as it's only done when necessary and it's properly documented.

It's okay to want to use C++, but that language has it's own issues and footguns (virtual destructors, "move semantics", C-style casts, header files and more) that Rust wants to avoid.

EDIT 2: Specialization is also kinda doable with deref coercion, but that's another can of worms I don't wanna open here.

EDIT 3: And if I had to mention some of Rust's footguns:

  • unwrap panics, which isn't bad in and of itself, but it's short so you'll probably want to use it instead of other error handling methods (see recent Cloudflare outages)
  • unsafe functions implicitly allows using unsafe operations (fixable by adding #! [deny(unsafe_op_in_unsafe_fn)])
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[-] for_some_delta@beehaw.org 21 points 4 days ago

I don't get it.

Maybe the joke is nothing complex is written in fad languages?

Maybe the joke is the discounting of peer review and testing?

Maybe the joke is the lack of devops knowledge where Python is extra steps over other scripting languages?

It seems like promotion of fad languages. When I was younger, I chased fads and lost hard. I'll stick with C and C++. Run-time failures happen to everyone including fad languages. Here's looking at you Rust CVE's. Better to have loved and lost, something, something.

[-] echodot@feddit.uk 6 points 3 days ago

I'm completely confused by why they seem to think it's impossible to have coding errors in rust. I'm also confused as to why they seem to think that errors are actually a problem. You get them you fix them. Who cares about what language you do it in.

This stinks of somebody who's been in the industry for about 2 years and now thinks they're hot shit.

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[-] wer2@lemmy.zip 11 points 4 days ago

Sounds like they want Ada Spark and not Rust.

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this post was submitted on 28 Dec 2025
403 points (95.7% liked)

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