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submitted 1 week ago by Gsus4@mander.xyz to c/technology@lemmy.world
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[-] thericofactor@sh.itjust.works 33 points 1 week ago

Sodium ion batteries have less energy density as opposed to Lithium ion (100-150 WH per Kg instead of 150-250). I'm curious how much these "wet" batteries improve that. The article doesn't say.

Nonetheless, even if it's not the new battery for your car, it could be useful as energy storage for the grid, storing green (solar) energy for the night, and desalinating seawater at the same time.

[-] chocrates@piefed.world 8 points 1 week ago

We hear about a new battery chemistry like every week. Do most never get to commercialization?

[-] meco03211@lemmy.world 7 points 1 week ago

R&d on these I'm guessing takes a little while. And it greatly depends on what niche they fill. Like the poster above said these might have lower density. For applications that move, that's not usually good. How sensitive are they to hot and cold? That could necessitate thermal management.

[-] apftwb@lemmy.world 6 points 1 week ago

They mostly these articles are showing new avenues for research. Most are deadends usually due to issues with production/scalability.

Sodium Ions batteries are coming to market, however the issue is that Lithium Ion are just improving faster and making it harder for Sodium Ion batteries to compete.

[-] Jesus_666@lemmy.world 2 points 1 week ago

Unless other situations where the established technology wins due to inertia, sodium ion batteries have two benefits that make them interesting regardless:

Firstly, they are safer. A punctured sodium ion battery doesn't catch fire, which massively simplifies safety design. That makes them very attractive for certain scenarios, especially ones where density is a secondary concern. That in turn means they get further development money instead of withering on the vine.

Secondly, they require fewer hard-to-obtain materials, which makes them attractive from a strategic perspective. This one should be less important than the safety factor but it's also relevant.

I'm pretty sure we'll actually see wet sodium cells in the wild if they are actually practical. Sodium ion tech is already being commercialized and if this brings it within the same ballpark as lithium ion then it becomes a very interesting choice for vehicles due to instant crash safety gains.

[-] 0tan0d@lemmy.world 1 points 1 week ago

They also perform better in the cold making them a better choice for EVs in cold regions. This is why I think CATL saw the videos of cars getting killed by cold and pulled the trigger on retooling even with the lithium price crash.

[-] wonderingwanderer@sopuli.xyz 1 points 1 week ago

Not to mention from a human rights perspective, it's not just easier to obtain sodium than lithium but also more humane.

There is an industry for ethically-sourced materials, and even if this doesn't completely replace lithium it can still significantly reduce the amount needed to meet demand, which can also encourage more ethical practices in that supply chain too, such as sourcing it from areas with stronger labor laws.

[-] apftwb@lemmy.world 4 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

the strategy of retaining crystal interlayer water yielded a specific capacity of 280 mA h g−1 at 10 mA g−1, one of the highest capacities reported for SIB cathodes in literature.

All I could find. This isn't a statement about capacity(?) Units are wrong(?)

Its worth noting how preliminary this research is. Currently these "batteries" are just jars with chemicals.

https://pubs.rsc.org/en/Content/ArticleLanding/2025/TA/D5TA05128B

https://www.rsc.org/suppdata/d5/ta/d5ta05128b/d5ta05128b2.mp4

[-] Croquette@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 week ago

My very uneducated understanding is that sodium batteries can be produced virtually anywhere.

Not every battery application needs to maximize energy density, so sodium batteries are good where that is the case.

I also did not read about sodium ion batteries characteristics versus lithium ion, so there might also be other use cases where sodium ion batteries are better.

[-] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

No thermal runaway if I remember correct as those are not prone to exploding (unlike li-ion/li-po)

[-] iopq@lemmy.world 27 points 1 week ago

Desalinating water might be the best part. Usually, solar power has the downside of needing storage and desalination has the downside of big energy requirements. If you can do both at the same time, it's a big win for dry climates with lots of sun

[-] realitista@lemmus.org 0 points 1 week ago

I can't imagine it's doing this at a rate that will make a big impact on water supply, I suspect this is one of those things they throw in just to have a good headline.

[-] iopq@lemmy.world 0 points 1 week ago

Water supply where? In Saudi Arabia it could be revolutionary tech when combined with solar

[-] realitista@lemmus.org 0 points 1 week ago

Not, for example, if it's only producing 1l/day.

[-] iopq@lemmy.world 1 points 1 week ago

But you can't imagine it doing a lot more?

[-] FlyForABeeGuy@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 1 week ago

There is also the issue with the salt by itself in desalinisation. If it's removed with water, you have to deal with that stuff. Table salt is really cheap and there is plenty of offer,, so you can't really economically clean it enough and package it for human consumption or industrial use. So what usually happens is that they dump it back at one moment or another. And that is a hard pollution, and can lead to dead zones around the desalinisation plants if not managed well enough. Being able to add it in a high demand product such as batteries takes all those hurdles away

Make it into bricks and build a pyramid somewhere really dry?

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[-] SirMaple__@lemmy.ca 14 points 1 week ago
[-] SpaceCowboy@lemmy.ca 2 points 1 week ago

Sodium Ion is a real game changer. But I doubt it will compete with Lithium Ion on energy density anytime soon.

But that's not necessary to make major changes in the power grid. Solar and wind is already cheapest form of energy generation even considering the expense of Lithium to store the energy when renewables aren't generating. If you're just installing stationary battery banks, you don't care that much about the energy density as you would for a battery in a car or phone. Set up banks of cheap sodium ion batteries strategically and not only do you have plenty of power stored for when it's not sunny or windy, you may avoid widespread power outages when power lines are downed.

I can only hope these can actually hit commercialization, unlike most new battery technologies that never leave the lab.

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[-] turdburglar@piefed.social 2 points 1 week ago

i’ll take 10 please.

[-] humanspiral@lemmy.ca 1 points 1 week ago

Sodium Ion already does 5000+ cycles. Adding Vanadium is not a scalable material. It is very expensive. 400 cycles steady is not useful information because it needs to do much more. They didn't state a wh/kg density. This is probably not a viable research vector, but "big Vanadium" has proposed a rental model to make Vanadium more scarce for other applications. Flow batteries (a fuel cell with tanks of electrolytes) provides an ultra easy way of recycling/selling the vanadium for traditional uses. Battery rental that forces returning it could be viable.

[-] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 1 week ago

Doesnt matter if the capacity is even less than sodium batteries.

We'll see.

[-] froh42@lemmy.world 1 points 1 week ago

TWICE AS MUCH COMPARED TO WHAT????

My left ball?

[-] freepizza4life@lemmy.world 1 points 1 week ago

Compared to a non-hydrous sodium vanadium oxide system.

[-] froh42@lemmy.world 1 points 1 week ago

Yep, I'm just annoyed by lazy headlines.

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[-] rob_t_firefly@lemmy.world 1 points 1 week ago

To answer your question we'll need to conduct a series of electrical tests on your left ball. Please report to the lab as soon as possible, and wear loose pants.

[-] Abundance114@lemmy.world 1 points 1 week ago

Uh, can we do this experiment on someone else's balls? Asking for a friend.

[-] nek0d3r@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 1 week ago
[-] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago
[-] nek0d3r@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 1 week ago

That face is glorious. My mood has skyrocketed.

[-] vaultdweller013@sh.itjust.works 0 points 1 week ago

You can throw any battery in the ocean. The better question is should you?

[-] Rakonat@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago

Who else is going to feed the eels?

[-] Zwuzelmaus@feddit.org 1 points 1 week ago

Finally a new one!

It was too quiet during the whole last year. But before, we had about 2 revolutionary new battery technologies every week.

[-] Reygle@lemmy.world 1 points 1 week ago

Every week with the "miracle battery!" headlines. This has been going on for ages and I'm sick of it.

[-] RaoulDook@lemmy.world 2 points 1 week ago

Sodium-ion batteries are not hype though, they are in production use in multiple industries already. They are generally superior to Lithium based batteries in all regards, with the exception of having a bit lower energy density. An equivalent LiFePO4 battery might be 70-80% of the size for the same storage. It's not a big deal for large applications like cars and solar storage.

[-] J92@lemmy.world 2 points 1 week ago

Yeah, the advantages of all these sodium batteries, in my mind, is that they are stable and rugged enough to build up a backbone of a energy storage system for a grid. I'm seriously thinking about them for my house, in the UK.

[-] WorldsDumbestMan@lemmy.today 0 points 1 week ago
[-] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 1 week ago

Low capacity is my guess.
Dunno if the article is the same I have read a few days ago but the, mentioned "everything" except the comparable capacity to sodium or lithium batteries.
And I can't imagine that the capacity for salty water with tofu remnants is much higher than a sodium battery which is atm serialized for mass production runs (isnt it even available in some capacity as a commercial product?)

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this post was submitted on 25 Feb 2026
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