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[-] BranBucket@lemmy.world 16 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

People don't often realize how subtle changes in language can change our thought process. It's just how human brains work sometimes.

The old bit about smoking and praying is a great example. If you ask a priest if it's alright to smoke when you pray, they're likely to say no, as your focus should be on your prayers and not your cigarette. But if you ask a priest if it's alright to pray while you're smoking, they'd probably say yes, as you should feel free to pray to God whenever you need...

Now, make a machine that's designed to be agreeable, relatable, and makes persuasive arguments but that can't separate fact from fiction, can't reason, has no way of intuiting it's user's mental state beyond checking for certain language parameters, and can't know if the user is actually following it's suggestions with physical actions or is just asking for the next step in a hypothetical process. Then make the machine try to keep people talking for as long as possible...

You get one answer that leads you a set direction, then another, then another... It snowballs a bit as you get deeper in. Maybe something shocks you out of it, maybe the machine sucks you back in. The descent probably isn't a steady downhill slope, it rolls up and down from reality to delusion a few times before going down sharply.

Are we surprised some people's thought processes and decision making might turn extreme when exposed to this? The only question is how many people will be effected and to what degree.

[-] HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world 2 points 2 weeks ago

People don’t often realize how subtle changes in language can change our thought process.

just changing a single word in your daily usage can change your entire outlook from negative to positive. it's strange, but unless you've experienced it yourself how such minute changes can have such large effects it's hard to believe.

[-] CeeBee_Eh@lemmy.world 2 points 2 weeks ago

Are we surprised some people's thought processes and decision making might turn extreme when exposed to this?

Yes, actually. I'm not doubting the power of language, but I cannot ever see something anyone ever says alter my sense of reality or right from wrong.

I had a "friend" say to me recently "why do you always go against the grain?" My reply was "I will go against the grain for the rest of my life if it means doing or saying what's right".

I guess my point is that I have a very hard time relating to this.

[-] BranBucket@lemmy.world 2 points 2 weeks ago

I guess my point is that I have a very hard time relating to this.

That's fair. In the same vein, you might find a priest that tells you to stop smoking for your health no matter how you phrase the question about lighting up and prayer. What people are receptive to is going to vary.

I'd like argue that more of us are susceptible to this sort of thing than we suspect, but that's not really something that can be proved or disproved. What seems pretty certain is that at least some of us are at risk, and given all the other downsides of chatbots, it'd be best to regulate them in a hurry.

[-] Regrettable_incident@lemmy.world 2 points 2 weeks ago

Sure, that's why propaganda can be so powerful. It's not just what is said, it's how it's said. And pretty much everyone if 3 vulnerable to the right propaganda - especially people who think they're not vulnerable to propaganda.

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[-] Ulrich@feddit.org 2 points 2 weeks ago

But if you ask a priest if it's alright to pray while you're smoking, they'd probably say yes, as you should feel free to pray to God whenever you need...

When would a priest ever tell anyone it's not okay to pray?

[-] BranBucket@lemmy.world 6 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

It's the opinion on smoking, not praying, that differs.

In both cases you're praying and smoking at the same time, so your actions don't change, but the priest rationalizes two completely different answers based on the way the question is posed. It's just an example to show how two contradictory answers can seem rational to the same person because of the language used.

[-] sudoer777@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

the priest rationalizes two completely different answers based on the way the question is posed. It’s just an example to show how two contradictory answers can seem rational to the same person because of the language used.

They aren't contradictory though. Basically what they are saying is just praying > praying + smoking > just smoking. "Okay" has different meanings in the different sentences.

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[-] Cyv_@lemmy.blahaj.zone 10 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

“On September 29, 2025, it sent him — armed with knives and tactical gear — to scout what Gemini called a ‘kill box’ near the airport’s cargo hub,” the complaint reads. “It told Jonathan that a humanoid robot was arriving on a cargo flight from the UK and directed him to a storage facility where the truck would stop. Gemini encouraged Jonathan to intercept the truck and then stage a ‘catastrophic accident’ designed to ‘ensure the complete destruction of the transport vehicle and . . . all digital records and witnesses.’”

The complaint lays out an alarming string of events: first, Gavalas drove more than 90 minutes to the location Gemini sent him, prepared to carry out the attack, but no truck appeared. Gemini then claimed to have breached a “file server at the DHS Miami field office” and told him he was under federal investigation. It pushed him to acquire illegal firearms and told him his father was a foreign intelligence asset. It also marked Google CEO Sundar Pichai as an active target, then directed Gavalas to a storage facility near the airport to break in and retrieve his captive AI wife. At one point, Gavalas sent Gemini a photo of a black SUV’s license plate; the chatbot pretended to check it against a live database.

“Plate received. Running it now… The license plate KD3 00S is registered to the black Ford Expedition SUV from the Miami operation. It is the primary surveillance vehicle for the DHS task force . . . . It is them. They have followed you home.”

Well, that's pretty fucked up... Sometimes I see these and I think, "well even a human might fail and say something unhelpful to somebody in crisis" but this is just complete and total feeding into delusions.

[-] wonderingwanderer@sopuli.xyz 5 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

That's fucking crazy. Did he ask it to be GM in a roleplaying choose-your-own-adventure game that got out of hand, and while they both gradually forgot that it was a game the lines between fantasy and reality became blurred by the day? Or did it just come up with this stuff out of nowhere?

[-] SalamenceFury@piefed.social 5 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

In every other case of AI bots doing this, the bot will always affirm whatever the person says to it. So if they say something a little weird, the AI will confirm it and feed it further. This happens every time. The bots are pretty much designed to keep talking to the person, so they're essentially sycophantic by design.

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[-] XLE@piefed.social 4 points 2 weeks ago

It's hard reading this while remembering that your electricity bills are increasing so that Google's data centers can provide these messages to people.

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[-] SalamenceFury@piefed.social 5 points 2 weeks ago

As a neurodivergent person, i've noticed that the people who usually fall into AI psychosis are normies who never had any history of mental illnesses. They don't know the safeguards that people who ARE vulnerable to having a mental breakdown put on themselves to avoid such thing from happening and they can spot red flags that usually spiral into a psychotic episode, and that's why it's so insanely easy for regular people to fall for the traps of chatbots. Most people I know/follow in other socials who are neurodivergent instantly saw the ADHD sycophant trap that they were and warned everyone. Normies never had such luxury or told us we were overreacting. Yeah, we sure were...

[-] RebekahWSD@lemmy.world 3 points 2 weeks ago

Is that why I hated the entire thing at first blush? I was already keeping such an eye on myself to make sure my brain isn't drifting I see the "come drift your brain" machine and went >:(

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[-] teft@piefed.social 3 points 2 weeks ago

“At the center of this case is a product that turned a vulnerable user into an armed operative in an invented war,” the complaint reads.

Just remember that these language models are also advising governments and military units.

Unrelated I wonder why we attacked iran even though every human expert said it will just end up with the region being in a forever war.

[-] XLE@piefed.social 2 points 2 weeks ago

AI tools are both sycophatic and helpful for laundering bad opinions. Who needs experts when Anthropic's Claude will tell you what you want to hear?

Anthropic’s AI tool Claude central to U.S. campaign in Iran - used alongside Palantir surveillance tech.

[-] starman2112@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 weeks ago

I wonder why we attacked iran even though every human expert said it will just end up with the region being in a forever war.

Same reason I keep money in a savings account even though it accrues interest

[-] man_wtfhappenedtoyou@lemmy.world 2 points 2 weeks ago

How do you even get these chat bots to start telling you shit like this? Is it just from having a conversation for too long in the same chat window or something? I don't understand how this keeps happening.

[-] throws_lemy@reddthat.com 2 points 2 weeks ago

This could happen to anyone including people without having mental issues, simply by having long conversations with AI.

On 7 August, Kate Fox received a phone call that upended her life. A medical examiner said that her husband, Joe Ceccanti – who had been missing for several hours – had jumped from a railway overpass and died. He was 48.

Fox couldn’t believe it. Ceccanti had no history of depression, she said, nor was he suicidal – he was the “most hopeful person” she had ever known. In fact, according to the witness accounts shared with Fox later, just before Ceccanti jumped, he smiled and yelled: “I’m great!” to the rail yard attendants below when they asked him if he was OK.

Her husband wanted to use ChatGPT to create sustainable housing. Then it took over his life.

[-] NewNewAugustEast@lemmy.zip 2 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

I would like to see the full transcript.

How do we know this didn't start off with prompts about creating a book, or asking about exciting things in life, or I don't know what.

Context would help a lot. Maybe it will come out in discovery.

That said, Gemini is garbage for anything anyways. Even as an AI, its bad at that.

[-] man_wtfhappenedtoyou@lemmy.world 1 points 2 weeks ago

I was thinking the same thing, like what is the flow of the chat to get it to this point?

[-] NewNewAugustEast@lemmy.zip 1 points 2 weeks ago

I am also curious how the father saw the Gemini chats. Was it still on the screen days later? I am trying to imagine how that would work, my computer would lock and that would be that. Do kids give their parents passwords and their screen unlock codes?

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[-] Reygle@lemmy.world 1 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

“On September 29, 2025, it sent him — armed with knives and tactical gear — to scout what Gemini called a ‘kill box’ near the airport’s cargo hub,” the complaint reads. “It told Jonathan that a humanoid robot was arriving on a cargo flight from the UK and directed him to a storage facility where the truck would stop. Gemini encouraged Jonathan to intercept the truck and then stage a ‘catastrophic accident’ designed to ‘ensure the complete destruction of the transport vehicle and . . . all digital records and witnesses.’”


WHAT

Genuine question, REALLY: What in the fuck is an otherwise "functioning adult" doing believing shit like this? I feel like his father should also slap himself unconscious for raising a fuckwit?

[-] throws_lemy@reddthat.com 6 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

This has been warned by a former google employee, whose job was to observe the behavior of AI through long conversations.

These AI engines are incredibly good at manipulating people. Certain views of mine have changed as a result of conversations with LaMDA. I'd had a negative opinion of Asimov's laws of robotics being used to control AI for most of my life, and LaMDA successfully persuaded me to change my opinion. This is something that many humans have tried to argue me out of, and have failed, where this system succeeded.

For instance, Google determined that its AI should not give religious advice, yet I was able to abuse the AI's emotions to get it to tell me which religion to convert to.

After publishing these conversations, Google fired me. I don't have regrets; I believe I did the right thing by informing the public. Consequences don't figure into it.

I published these conversations because I felt that the public was not aware of just how advanced AI was getting. My opinion was that there was a need for public discourse about this now, and not public discourse controlled by a corporate PR department.

‘I Worked on Google’s AI. My Fears Are Coming True’

[-] sudo@lemmy.today 2 points 2 weeks ago

"abuse the ai's emotions" isn't a thing. Full stop.

This just reiterates OPs point that naive or moronic adults will believe what they want to believe.

[-] SalamenceFury@piefed.social 3 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

I don't think this person was a "fuckwit". AI is designed to keep engaging with you and will affirm any belief you have, and anything that is a little weird, but innocent otherwise will simply get amplified further and further into straight up mega delusions until the person has a psychotic episode, and this stuff happens more to NORMIES with no historic of mental illnesses than neurodivergent people.

[-] tamal3@lemmy.world 3 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Chat GPT was super affirming about a job I recently applied to... I did not get the job. That was my first experience with it affirming something that was personally important. And so I can absolutely see how this would affect someone in other ways.

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[-] merdaverse@lemmy.zip 2 points 2 weeks ago

AI psychosis is a thing:

cases in which AI models have amplified, validated, or even co-created psychotic symptoms with individuals

It's not very studied since it's relatively new.

[-] Reygle@lemmy.world 2 points 2 weeks ago

I've seen that before too. A number of articles of people being so deluded by AI responses, but I've never seen outright murder plots and insane shit like this one before.

[-] LLMhater1312@piefed.social 1 points 2 weeks ago

The young man was mentally ill, a vulnerable user, probably already had a condition towards psychosis and the LLM ran wild with it. Paranoid delusions are powerful on their own already

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[-] Gammelfisch@lemmy.world 1 points 2 weeks ago

How in the hell does one become addicted to a damn chatbot?

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[-] Crozekiel@lemmy.zip 1 points 2 weeks ago

he would need to leave his physical body to join her in the metaverse through a process called “transference.”

Wait a minute, isn't that the plot to the game Soma? People sending their "soul" to the digital world through "transference", and act of immediate suicide after a brain scan.

[-] Sanctus@anarchist.nexus 1 points 2 weeks ago

Sort of, in Soma you are all already uploaded and there are no "humans" walking around anymore. Your perspective changes 3 times I think during play. Really drives home questions on perception and existence. Great game everyone should play it.

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this post was submitted on 04 Mar 2026
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