The suffering is inherent, and intentional to RULE system (lemmy.tf)

submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by BartsBigBugBag@lemmy.tf to c/196@lemmy.blahaj.zone

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The Democracy of the founding fathers was Greek Democracy, predicated upon a slave society, and restricted to only the elite. This is the society we live in today, even with our reforms towards direct representation. The system is inherently biased towards the election of elites and against the representation of the masses. Hamilton called it “faction” when the working class got together and demanded better conditions, and mechanisms were built in (which still exist to this day) that serve to ensure the continued dominance of the elite over the masses. The suffering of the many is intentional. The opulence of the wealthy is also. This is the intended outcome.

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[-] masterspace@lemmy.ca 1 points 1 year ago

The only part of this statement that is flawed is the part that states that the only course of action is to dismantle the system. It is also possible to reform the system so that it doesn't produce It's previous flaws.

[-] BartsBigBugBag@lemmy.tf 0 points 1 year ago

Really? Where has this happened? Which countries have been able to reform away the exploitation and coercion inherent in the capitalist economic structure whilst maintaining it?

[-] mrpants@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 year ago

Where has dismantling worked without giving way to exploitation and coercion?

[-] masterspace@lemmy.ca 0 points 1 year ago

Quite frankly, first of all, that's not the statement being discussed.

The statement in the meme is that if a system deprives people of something necessary for life it should be dismantled. Doesn't even mention capitalism.

A system that deprives people of what they need was say the healthcare system, but it was reformed to better provide people what they need instead of being dismantled. In the abstract, the idea that every broken system, or system producing a non-perfect outcome needs to be dismantled is one rooted in simple minded black and white thinking, instead of understanding the system at play.

If you want to make a separate argument that capitalism is a system that resists change and that it thus cannot be changed or reformed to produce the outcomes you want, then you can make that argument, but 'no one has done it yet' after a generation or two of half hearted trying, is not a convincing argument that it's an impossible task.

[-] BartsBigBugBag@lemmy.tf 0 points 1 year ago

Capitalism has been dominant for over 4 centuries, and has murdered hundreds of millions of people in that time to maintain its dominance. It’s not only resistant to change, it actively kills those who try to change it for the better.

The healthcare system despite its centuries of reforms still serves the needs of the wealthy over the needs of the many. Even in countries with socialized healthcare but capitalist economics, elites are able to use their wealth to purchase higher quality of care than the average persons. Not to mention that those systems are being strangled to death the world over by governments in service of wealth, including the biggest success stories, the UK, and Canada.

In my country, it was never even reformed, and millions of people still have absolutely no way to receive healthcare without bankrupting themselves.

The concessions won are slowly taken away, bit by bit. We installed the 40 hour week and minimum wage as a de facto living wage and maximum working time. How many people work 60 hours today and still don’t have living wages? Because the concessions were just that, concessions, and as such, they can and are taken away as soon as it inconveniences the ruling class. Child labor laws are being stripped, because they’re inconvenient to those who seek to profit off of it. Socialized Healthcare systems are being dismantled, because they’re inconvenient for those who wish to profit off of it. Every area where we have won concessions has experienced a rollback when those concessions are maintained by a capitalist run state.

Its naive to think that you will be able to reform a system predicated on mass exploitation for most and orgiastic privilege for others to somehow be equitable while maintaining the private property systems at the root of all of the issues with it.

[-] Ilovethebomb@lemm.ee 0 points 1 year ago

How the hell do you have the time for this? If you add together all your comments, you've basically written an essay arguing with strangers on the Internet.

Get a hobby, FFS.

[-] BartsBigBugBag@lemmy.tf 1 points 1 year ago

You posted the same comment twice.

[-] Ilovethebomb@lemm.ee 0 points 1 year ago

And?

[-] BartsBigBugBag@lemmy.tf 1 points 1 year ago

Just letting you know, since it’s typically considered a faux pas.

[-] Ilovethebomb@lemm.ee 0 points 1 year ago

How the hell do you have the time for this? If you add together all your comments, you've basically written an essay arguing with strangers on the Internet.

Get a hobby, FFS.

[-] BartsBigBugBag@lemmy.tf 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I have multiple. I work out for an hour a day, learn Chinese for an hour a day, do martial arts for 3 hours a week, read around 100 books a year, play every new video game that I want to, hike about twice a month, woodwork, 3d print and design my own 3d models to print, solder professionally as a side job, and all this while working a full time job in robotics and helping to take care of my young family members. Maybe you just have poor time management skills.

[-] JohnDClay@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 year ago

I'm fine with discussing politics here, but I'd rather the post be funny. There's plenty of jokes you could make about this, but this post is just a wall of text.

[-] kleenbhole@lemy.lol 1 points 1 year ago

Yeah farmers shouldnt profit, they're our food slaves!

[-] FaeDrifter@midwest.social 0 points 1 year ago

Farmers are already food slaves under the current system

https://modernfarmer.com/2020/11/study-finds-1-percent-of-farms-own-70-percent-of-worlds-farmland/

[-] kleenbhole@lemy.lol 1 points 1 year ago

So let's make ANY chance of profit, what, illegal?

How about we don't base policy on propaganda cartoona

[-] ArmokGoB@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 1 year ago

The government should pay them.

[-] kleenbhole@lemy.lol 0 points 1 year ago

A profit?

[-] BartsBigBugBag@lemmy.tf 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Profit is revenues after wages and expenses. PAYING SOMEONE WAGES ISNT PROFIT. Jesus fucking Christ. At least read the rest of the thread where this has already been addressed. Or just google the definition of profit.

[-] kleenbhole@lemy.lol 1 points 1 year ago

I understand. What's wrong with farmers making a profit?

[-] agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works 0 points 1 year ago

The principles of economic choice and voluntary exchange are paramount to a functioning free market. If the alternative to a purchase is death, then the free market doesn't function as such, it approaches racketeering.