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I genuinely do not know who the bad guys are. S lot of my leftist friends are against Israel, but from what I know Israel was attacked and is responding and trying to get their hostages back.

Enlighten me. Am I wrong? Why am I wrong?

And dumb it down for me, because apparently I'm an idiot.

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[-] tupalos@lemmy.world 8 points 3 weeks ago

The volunteers that risk going to do stuff in either side. It’s crazy out there

[-] BallsandBayonets@lemmings.world 7 points 3 weeks ago

Well obviously it's the Western powers that gave a bunch of displaced Jews land after WWII, despite no legitimate claim to the area, and then proceeded to keep meddling in Middle Eastern affairs so they could get cheap oil. And the biggest of those Western powers directly gives taxpayer money to war profiteers so there's a direct financial incentive to keep the genocide going.

Those are the goodest guys.

[-] TheOubliette@lemmy.ml 7 points 3 weeks ago

The Zionist project was going full steam ahead prior to WWII. Zionists collaborated with Nazis to get Jewish people to emigrate or get deported to Palestine. And Holocaust survivors were often looked down on there are Jews that had not done the "right" thing of abandoning their homes to steal someone else's in Palestine. Zionists spread some of the most antisemitix things you have ever heard when it comes to this topic.

The backer of Zionism simply switched hands after WWII. Before it was the British, then it was the US.

[-] schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de 6 points 3 weeks ago

I mean the whole reason why you are confused is that this is the most complex conflict in the world and here (like everywhere else) you are going to get responses in both directions. I suggest you read what each side has to say for itself: for unconditional pro-Israeli propaganda I suggest https://elderofziyon.blogspot.com/ and for unconditional pro-Palestinian propaganda I suggest https://mondoweiss.net/ – read both of these and decide for yourself what arguments on both sides you believe more.

I do not think there are any truly good guys in the conflict; but I do think that Israel is worse and tend to side with the Palestinians. This is mainly because Israel is the side with vastly more power and I think it's up to the powerful, the oppressor, to try to treat the people they have power over with dignity and try to give up the power they have.

Of course, even that argument of mine has a counter-argument! You can (and should!) read it here: https://elderofziyon.blogspot.com/2016/07/the-parameters-of-discussion-michael.html

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[-] EndlessNightmare@reddthat.com 5 points 3 weeks ago

I don't have any inherent support either side, and there's too much history along with bias, propaganda, and outright misinformation to make a determination of who the "good guys" are, if anyone.

However, in such cases I will support the underdog on the principle that you don't really want one side to have too much power over the other. That's how we end up with things like ethnic cleansing and genocide. If Palestine (and Lebanon) had powerful militaries, you wouldn't be seeing the mass devastation and huge loss of civilian lives. I'd prefer to see the sides more balanced so that they can keep each other in check.

Another angle to consider is that I consider the state of Israel to be actively harmful to Americans on the basis of:

  • using our tax dollars to commit mass murder against civilians, including a staggering death toll for children

  • infiltrating our government, interfering with our elections, and having an undue level of influence on American policy

  • corollary to the preceding point: they support getting Trump back into the White House

  • training American law enforcement, who then use their oppressive tactics on Americans

  • similarly, technology they develop for surveillance and other means of control being used on Americans

  • directly attacking our First Amendment rights

Bottom line is I'd say everyone sucks, but in different ways. But I am anti-Israel on the basis of them being way out of control (and without anyone to keep them in check) and due to the threat they pose to the American public.

[-] Hello_there@fedia.io 5 points 3 weeks ago

Where are you getting news, and how often?

[-] sylver_dragon@lemmy.world 5 points 3 weeks ago

War rarely decides who's right, just who's left.

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this post was submitted on 03 Nov 2024
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