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submitted 2 weeks ago by Yuritopiaposadism@hexbear.net to c/chapotraphouse@hexbear.net

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[-] Lowleekun@hexbear.net 34 points 2 weeks ago

Not too sure about the last sentence as it took my dumb fucking ass until the latest genocide in Gaza but I get the sentiment

[-] BeanisBrain@hexbear.net 39 points 2 weeks ago

I feel like you can stratify leftists like rock layers by the point at which they stopped winning the "fell for it again" award

The first time I was never fooled at any point, I'm deeply embarrassed to say, was Ukraine

[-] Mardoniush@hexbear.net 20 points 2 weeks ago

Arab Spring for me, though I wasn't fooled by Iraq.

It's not until you've seen good communists, friends and comrades, with strong critiques of the system they're under get fed into the grist of colour revolution for nothing. For worse than nothing. That you begin to understand.

[-] AfricanExpansionist@lemmy.ml 16 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

I was 19 and I believed George W Bush when he came on TV and told Americans about WMD.

I think the blinders quickly fell from my eyes... That administration radicalized me

As for Ukraine... I didn't know enough about that country and its political history or culture to have a strong opinion about it, although I recall thinking that it was a very Iraq-like move by Putin. It still doesn't look like it was the smartest move, but 🤷 I just want to see western Ukraine ceded to Russia already so that people can stop dying for abstractions

[-] Le_Wokisme@hexbear.net 13 points 2 weeks ago

there's a john mearschimer presentation from before the invasion that goes over a lot of it. i think it's on the university of chicago youtube page.

the other part of it is the coup/color revolution in 2014 and apparently nobody killed enough nazi collaborators back in the day.

[-] AfricanExpansionist@lemmy.ml 8 points 2 weeks ago

Ah yes, I remember that stuff got really nuts there in 2014 (and 2011?). They should have let the country split then

[-] narr1@lemmygrad.ml 14 points 2 weeks ago

Hey don't worry, I fell for that one initially. Took until Oct 7 until I really started seeing through it all if you will.

Ukraine is kinda close-by geographically, and geopolitically we "share the enemy" because we had ties with the nazis during WWII, and the Soviets invaded in ’39 to secure St. Petersburg (then known as Leningrad) from a joint Axis attack from the north along the Karelian isthmus.

Tap for spoiler

Of course people don't care to remember that we did eventually invade back into Soviet territory (further than previous borders) during Operation Barbarossa, which included a joint attack and eventual siege of Leningrad (I've heard tell that it was our own marshall Mannerheim who decided that bombing the ice road across lake Ladoga and thus condemning the people there to starvation was a reasonable thing to do, but then again we also had concentration camps back then far the Karelians so I guess they just actually were really fucking racist)

But even the fact that the chairman or whatever of my country's most popular far-right political party went to address the Ukraine parliament, speaking himself Ukrainian for some reason, didn't straight away make me question the narrative.