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Zelensky refuses to hold elections in wartime Ukraine
(www.newsweek.com)
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this post was submitted on 07 Nov 2023
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I'd be interested to see the comments if this were Putin.
Feel free to check back in with us when Russia is the victim of a major invasion
I'm just not sure why being the invaded party is the deciding factor here. Do the people not get a say in who leads their defense, only their offense?
Ok so you're being intentionally obtuse. Got it ๐
No, I'm not. Could you please at least engage in the conversation if you're going to reply?
they don't owe you shit, troll. begone
Having a different perspective than you doesn't make me a troll. I never thought I'd be called a troll for saying maybe they should conduct an election.
violating their own constitution. fuck off, you know what you're doing. you're being disingenuous and arguing in bad faith
I'm not familiar with Ukraine's constitution, but frankly I don't put much stock in the idea of an indelible constitution.
You'll usually have more luck convincing people of your perspective by not insulting them, btw.
i'm not trying to convince you. you're being disingenuous and arguing in bad faith.
Again, having a different perspective than you doesn't mean I am arguing in bad faith or being disingenuous. If you're not trying to have a conversation or convince me, then you're just being vitriolic for no reason, so I'm the one who is a troll? Come on man.
my comments are for everyone else.
THIS PERSON IS BEING DISINGENUOUS AND ARGUING IN BAD FAITH! I have no obligation to engage with them on their terms.
Rather false equivalency, don't you think? They're not comparable in any other way, thus the difference...
They are both (supposedly) elected officials of a (supposed) democratic state, and they are both at war. If Putin said he wasn't going to hold elections because it would be irresponsible to do so during a war, I don't think he'd get the same understanding answers. There's precedence for countries holding elections while at war, it's not like it's some infeasible thing. Just seems weird for everyone to be so quick to say that it's reasonable to suspend an election.
Because they are completely different situations. They are not merely "both at war," you are comparing the head of an invading country to the head of the country being invaded. And Putin has decades of history of overseeing dishonest elections. It's borderline gaslighting to feign ignorance of the differences.
Russia is trying to interfere with elections of countries it's not even at war with. Is Ukraine just never supposed to have an election again because Russia might interfere with it? Is it not up to Ukraine to ensure that their elections are free and fair? Like, I don't think that any precautions they would take against Russia interfering is gonna stop when the war stops.
Does Russia have a foreign army in their borders? Very strange use of the word precedence there... there are also cases where countries at war have postponed elections, isn't that precedence too? How is that relevant for Ukraine specifically?
It's not relevant for Ukraine specifically, it's relevant for anyone who would claim that free, fair, and regular elections are a cornerstone of democracy. Someone else said better than I could: shouldn't the people get a say in who is leading them in this war?
I think there's a pretty massive difference between being invaded and being the country orchestrating the invasion.
Probably similar, if a large portion of the populace would be unable to vote due to occupation by a foreign (former super-)power.
Do we have a rough idea what percentage of Ukrainians are under Russian control right now?
I do not, but the Ukraine most certainly has as well as people who know more about the topic than I do.
It's just Ukraine btw.
Well, thank you for your correction then. I hope you have also learned from this conversation.