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necrulemancy
(lemmy.blahaj.zone)
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this post was submitted on 07 Dec 2023
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In the Netherlands, we actually celebrate Sinterklaas (St Nicolas) on december 5th. It is when this guy comes to the houses of children to give them presents, like Santa does in the US, for instance. I even heard people say that Santa was derived from the figure of Sinterklaas, but I am not sure whether it is true.
In the weeks before Sinterklaas comes to the house, children put their shoes near the fireplace (and if they do not have a fireplace usually near the heater). They might sing some special Sinterklaas songs and put a carrot in their shoe for the which horse that Sinterklaas rides. Then during the night Sinterklaas and/or his helper Piet come on through the chimney and put smallngifts in the shoes. There are also a lot of other traditions around the Sinterklaas celebrations and there are cadies and cookies that are only eaten around this time like pepernoten and speculaas.
Sinterklaas has become controversial over the last few years, because according to the stories, he has helpers who are all called 'zwarte Piet' (black Pete). White people playing this character painted their phases brown or black and put on colorful clothing and black curly hair as well as making their lips red and put rings in their ears sometimes. One side of the argument says that they were representing black people or even slaves and basically that this was a case of blackface. The other side of the argument said that Piet was black because he came through the chimney and that this was not blackface. They also say that it does not matter to children whether Piet is black.
The people saying that Piet is racist seem to be winning the discussion. In most of the larger cities, Piet now looks less like a charicature of a black person and more like someone who came through the chimney. In other places they still have the traditional zwarte Piet. There is even some violence in some cases, where the people who think that Piet is a racist charcter will protest against it during the public parts of the celebrations for the children. They then get violently attacked by the people wanting to keep the tradition as it is
Putting carrots in shoes by the fireplace is the most Netherlandsly thing I have ever heard.
You guys are so harmlessly weird.
reads post about potentially racist Christmas characters and violence due to disagreements over this racism
Calls them harmlessly weird ¯_(ツ)_/¯
I'm just joking but found that kind of funny :)
I'm so kooky, just putting this shoe polish all over my face.
So quirky, heading out to be a Christmas minstrel.
Too zany, punching some protesters that want me to stop.
Excentrically tattooing swastikas on my face.
edit: jesus, "Christmas minstrels" was not something I expected from the jolly season.
Hm? That is not an article I have read. All I know is something about resurrected pickle babies. And carrots.
Ah, the comment you mean! Well, I'm glad I stopped reading before that part. It's the only way to stay sane nowadays.
You Santa-worshippers don't leave anything for his reindeer? Poor things.
Dutch Santa doesn't have reindeer.
Carrots are cheap. So there.
Thanks!
Wait, Sinterklaas has a witch horse? How does that work?
Like, does the horse cast spells or curse people? Does it wear a pointy black hat? Does Sinterklaas ride a horse that, in turn, rides a broom?
Or is it a horse he adopted after a witch didn't want it anymore? If so, what did the witch need a horse for when she had the broom? As a pack animal? For companionship? To disguise the fact that she's a witch while traveling above walking speed?
It's a white horse, OP's spell checking failed a few times
Aww, I'd become enamored with the idea of a witch horse pouts 😁
Yes, sorry! I was a bit tired when writing this and did not check the text afterwards. :-(
Lmao I hope the witch horse has better spell checking or someone is gonna have a bad time
The 5th of December?? In Germany, we celebrate it on the 6th in the morning, and we are the people who celebrate Christmas on the 24th (evening or afternoon)
Here it is the 5th, and we tell children it is the birthday of Sinterklaas.
According to wikipedia he was born on March 15th and died December 6th. But go on telling your children lies until they are ready to hear the truth.
We also tell them that he comes from Spain.
Tbf this was before nation states so the modern borders of Spain didn't exist yet so why no include modern day Turkey (which existed neither, nor was it populated my the linguistically and culturally ancestors of the modern Turks).
I did not know that. That is actually a really good explanation for that. Shows how old the tradition is.
6 december is the birthday of Sinterklaas in the Netherlands as well. Pakjesavond is 5 december.
Similar to what they do in Germany, except his helper's name is Ruprecht. And thankfully, he's not black.
Yeah, gonna call bullshit on that.
Yes, it is bullshit. You do not get black curly hair, red lips and earrings by going through the chimney.
Hey thanks Ive heard this story, basically through a game of telephone, and basically believed dutch people are wicked racist
Well, some of them are. However, I think one of the problems is that if you grow up with this celebration, it is a normal part of your life. White children do not get confronted with racism a lot, so they might not think about it and not notice that it is racist. At least, that was the case for me. Zwarte Piet was just the nice helper of Sinterklaas who brought me presents. I loved Sinterklaas and Zwarte Piet.
But as soon as someone said something, I knew they were right and I have been against Zwarte Piet ever since. For some people, it seems very hard to change their view of Zwarte Piet. It someone you loved when you grew up and now all of a sudden that makes you a racist? And they get defensive and even aggressive, unfortunately. It is still a heated debate, but the people wanting to change Zwarte Piet are winning, fortunately.
The only thing I am sad about is that the children now recognise who piet is. All though I do agree how zwarte piet is pretty racist/weird/outdated.
Sinterklaas. Santa Claus. Sounds pretty related to me.
It came to the US by way of Dutch immigrants, so yeah.