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this post was submitted on 19 Jul 2023
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20 years ago was 2003... any idea what was socially acceptable then that isn't now?
Not much, really. 20 years isn't a lot of time.
Think 50 years, or 100 years.
Homophobia was more common in 2003 but hadn't be socially acceptable for about a decade before that. Transphobia I'll give you.
That heavily depended on the area you were in - both geographically and topically. Should we let them die from AIDs, discussed in a major metro? You'd likely be shunned, but not by everyone. Should we let them get married, almost anywhere? Debated by a minority, mostly against in all but they must liberal of places. Should we let them around kids, or are they trying to "turn" you? Lots of people had very homophobic takes on that anywhere.
2003 was right in the middle of the tv show Will and Grace's famous culture shifting run, but it absolutely wasn't done yet. Pew's long-running survey showed in '03 only 47% of people saying we should approve of homosexuality. Not domestic partnerships, not gay marriage, literally just "being gay" was minority approved. If you think casual homophobia wasn't totally normal in 03, go watch Friends, the most popular sitcom in America at the time. Go watch Seinfeld's famous "not that there's anything wrong with that" episode... admittedly a few years earlier, but set in one of the most gay-friendly places in America, and little had changed in the intervening years.
Gay rights and acceptance has had a meteoric rise in the last 20 years. I think that's why young people see this new wave of anyi-LGBT stuff so shocking, but for anyone that was around it's only shocking if you have a bad memory. It was bad just yesterday.
Wasn't that episode of Seinfeld pretty revolutionary for it's time and still lauded by the LGBTQ+ community as groundbreaking? You're talking about it as if it mocked gays, but it was and still is seen as a groundbreaking episode of one of the biggest TV shows in history, and it helped normalize homosexuality. Did you just get Seinfeld Effected?
That's...exactly my point. Go watch it today. It's cringey because they don't want to be perceived as gay. Lots of stuff that was very forward thinking at the time doesn't hold up. And the fact that it was groundbreaking further cements that things have changed incredibly from when those attitudes were common.
Yeah, not like there was homophobia in rap music or anything after '93.
It's not like 2003 was the year DMX released "Where the Hood at?" ... and it made #68 on Billboard hot 100.
Everyone seems to forget this (incredibly explicit and homophobic) part of the song.
Not really, that was all not cool in 2003 as well. You might be thinking of 1993 or even 1983.
I remember anything bad was "gay" in 2003, and greedy/stingy people were told to stop being such "jews".
The school-yard game where you tried to keep possession of a football for as long as possible while everyone else tried to strip it away or tackle you was called "smear the queer".
Bowling alleys and bars had a visible haze of cigarette smoke.
Yeah, it was bad.
Maybe it's because I live in a progressive state, but I haven't heard "smear the queer" since the 70s.
We set up smoking vs. non-smoking areas in 1981 for gods sake. We allowed cities to be more strict in 2000.
I was in a red part of a blue state, so YMMV.
I remember the smoking areas: not that it prevented the entire restaurant from smelling of smoke. But they weren't a thing in bars or bowling alleys. In my state indoor smoking was finally banned entirely in 2008.
'09 here in Illinois. I was 18 for 4 days and could smoke indoors lol.
how old are you lol
54, time speeds up as you get older. 20 years goes fast. 10 is basically nothing!