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submitted 9 months ago by mossy_capivara@midwest.social to c/196@lemmy.blahaj.zone

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[-] Greyghoster@aussie.zone 25 points 9 months ago

First pass the post says a vote for anyone other than Biden is a vote for Trump. Sadly that’s how the system works. You need preferential voting to send a message of displeasure.

[-] spujb@lemmy.cafe 25 points 9 months ago

girl u may have missed that this was for the primaries, not the general election

[-] jwelch55@lemmy.world 12 points 9 months ago

So this will stop and everyone will rally behind Biden after the primaries? I hope so. This one issue is horrific, and I wish there was a reasonable 'no genocide; option. There really isn't though. And the sense I get lately is more 'don't vote Biden' generically, without acknowledging the impact this could have once we're through the primaries.

[-] glizzyguzzler@lemmy.blahaj.zone 15 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

This type of vote will not be called for in the general because in the general, even if Biden does not change his stance on ending the Palestinian genocide, because the fascist republican alternative is worse.

Anyone who is calling for “don’t vote Biden” in the general election is a fascist. You can disregard them as they’re very likely just Russian bots trying to sow discontent.

I see many people who keep commenting here are not in tune with the “uncommitted vote” campaign because no major news org has really covered it. They don’t cover it because it is to end the Palestinian genocide and major news orgs have held a pro-Zionist line the entire time (e.g., there was a 400,000+ anti-genocide-in-Palestine march in DC maybe a month ago, and no news orgs covered it in any meaningful way (AP had coverage downplaying it the day before and none the day of) or at all (NYT did not cover it).). This is to once more try to enact the end of a US-funded genocide via the will of the voters in a safe way, as Biden is guaranteed to win the primary.

[-] glizzyguzzler@lemmy.blahaj.zone 20 points 9 months ago

You do not understand how the US primary system works.

This was not the general election vote where Biden will face a fascist.

This was a 2nd term president democratic primary, which the incumbent almost always sweeps. This allows for protest voting with no actual repercussions like fascists winning.

They are protesting the active genocide of the Palestinian people, it is worth the effort to try to enact change which no downsides.

[-] bl_r@lemmy.dbzer0.com 9 points 9 months ago

No shit thats how the system works. Its a hierarchical representative democracy with FPTP voting in a capitalist country, and we are seeing the inevitable endpoint of such a system. A system like our glorious failure of “democracy” will end in despots and fascists trying to sieze power through populism.

But you don’t need preferential voting to send a message of displeasure. There is nothing about FPTP that says you are incapable of voicing displeasure, it is done via different means than preferential voting.

The idea that a vote for biden is a vote for trump is a complete fallacy. In this failed republic, we don’t even have popular voting for the president. In many places around the country, your vote literally does not matter because of FPTP voting. If I’m unfortunate enough to live in a deep red state where there is no hope of the GOP losing, what difference does my vote make?

If I am more fortunate and live in a deep blue state, what difference does it make if I don’t vote at all? It’s incredibly unlikely biden will lose there, even if Biden is deeply unpopular amongst the voting base.

If I live in a swing state, you might then have an actual incentive to vote. But there is still the catch on what district you live in, because even in swing states there are some districts that are deel blue or deep red.

Because of the Electoral College the concept that “a vote for anyone other than Biden is a vote for Trump” is complete horseshit for the majority of Americans. This is just a strategy to shame people into voting for someone they don’t like.

Not voting, or voting for third parties is the way to send displeasure with our two parties. Trying to restrict the only ways to voice displeasure is extremely unhealthy for what we claim is a democratic system. It is like taking painkillers to treat what would otherwise be treatable cancer. If you ignore the problem it will grow until it becomes untenable.

Leaving this threat open does a lot to shape policy. If that avenue was closed, the political elite class would have a less incentive to consider the needs of the working class. Considering there is a modicum of “democratic” choice in the US, if the needs are not considered, eventually the political class will make enough mistakes that people give up, and they will lose support, possibly for a long while.

Shaming people to vote is also a genuinely bad strategy. I was fucking pissed about this shit in 2016 and in 2020, even if I despise trump. Being shamed into an action is not exactly a good feeling, and having it repeatedly happen doesn’t exactly breed confidence in the system, it breeds contempt. If you are making a part of your own voting base feel contempt with you or the system, you are shooting yourself in the foot. It might have short term gains, but I worry that you will lose voters in the future.

Finally, this is the primaries. This election does not determine the outcome of the election in a given state or the nation as a whole, but it will demonstrate what could happen if Biden doesn’t change his strategy of ignoring the problem.