this post was submitted on 15 Mar 2024
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Lefty Memes
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An international (English speaking) socialist Lemmy community free of the "ML" influence of instances like lemmy.ml and lemmygrad. This is a place for undogmatic shitposting and memes from a progressive, anti-capitalist and truly anti-imperialist perspective, regardless of specific ideology.
Serious posts, news, and discussion go in c/Socialism.
If you are new to socialism, you can ask questions and find resources over on c/Socialism101.
Please don't forget to help keep this community clean by reporting rule violations, updooting good contributions and downdooting those of low-quality!
Rules
Version without spoilers
0. Only post socialist memes
That refers to funny image macros and means that generally videos and screenshots are not allowed. Exceptions include explicitly humorous and short videos, as well as (social media) screenshots depicting a funny situation, joke, or joke picture relating to socialist movements, theory, societal issues, or political opponents. Examples would be the classic case of humorous Tumblr or Twitter posts/threads.
(and no, agitprop text does not count as a meme)
1. Socialist Unity in the form of mutual respect and good faith interactions is enforced here
Try to keep an open mind, other schools of thought may offer points of view and analyses you haven't considered yet. Also: This is not a place for the Idealism vs. Materialism or rather Anarchism vs. Marxism debate(s), for that please visit c/AnarchismVsMarxism.
2. Anti-Imperialism means recognizing capitalist states like Russia and China as such
That means condemning (their) imperialism, even if it is of the "anti-USA" flavor.
3. No liberalism, (right-wing) revisionism or reactionaries.
That includes so called: Social Democracy, Democratic Socialism, Dengism, Market Socialism, Patriotic Socialism, National Bolshevism, Anarcho-Capitalism etc. . Anti-Socialist people and content have no place here, as well as the variety of "Marxist"-"Leninists" seen on lemmygrad and more specifically GenZedong (actual ML's are welcome as long as they agree to the rules and don't just copy paste/larp about stuff from a hundred years ago).
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The only dangerous minority is the rich.
5. Don't demonize previous and current socialist experiments or (leading) individuals.
We must constructively learn from their mistakes, while acknowledging their achievements and recognizing when they have strayed away from socialist principles.
(if you are reading the rules to apply for modding this community, mention "Mantic Minotaur" when answering question 2)
6. Don't idolize/glorify previous and current socialist experiments or (leading) individuals.
Notable achievements in all spheres of society were made by various socialist/people's/democratic republics around the world. Mistakes, however, were made as well: bureaucratic castes of parasitic elites - as well as reactionary cults of personality - were established, many things were mismanaged and prejudice and bigotry sometimes replaced internationalism and progressiveness.
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Except "neoliberal" is insulting because it's accurate.
It's never changed meaning. People just began to realize that neoliberalism is awful and neoliberals are calling it an insult to be accurately described. Exactly like TERFs.
It's not like mentally retarded can't be accurate. But it's the intent and repeated use as an insult that makes an insult and insult. Could just be a neutral descriptor because in itself it doesn't mean something insulting.
It literally can't. That's not the scientifically used word anymore because people changed it into an ableist insult meaning something else than the original descriptive term.
Nobody's changed the meaning of the word neoliberal. That neoliberals pretend otherwise to avoid being called out for being neoliberals doesn't change the meaning of the word or the legitimacy of its use.
You are describing how it was the accurate, descriptive medical term but how the use as an insult made it so that it's an insult. Isn't that exactly what I was saying?
It was and sometimes still is used neutrally as a descriptor of certain type of economic policies. Those who view those economic ideas and policies negatively use it as an insult. In that respect it's the same as "communist", it's not inherently negative and just means someone who believes in the idea of communism. But some, who dislike communism, use it as an insult.
No. You were saying that the meaning of the r-word hasn't changed and can be accurately used to describe what it originally did. That's not true.
Because that's what it means. Always have, always will.
Because to people who know how awful neoliberalism is, it's insulting to be labeled as an adherent of that ideology.
Insulting doesn't automatically mean inaccurate or without use as a factual descriptor.
No it isn't.The vast majority of the people who use the word communist to insult don't know what it actually means beyond cold war propaganda equating it with misery and deliberate evil.
People who use the word neoliberal in a disparaging way are fully aware of the actual meaning and are using that as the insult, not some Reaganesque caricature.
Neoliberals pretend to be centrist or center-left and don't want to be called out as Neoliberals, since everyone knows that's a center right to right wing ideology.
Just like Republicans exhibiting all 14 common characteristics of fascism don't want to be called out on being fascists because people know that fascism is bad.
Emphasized the relevant part. Would be silly to say something started as something and mean it is just the same now. It's like the joke "I used to".
I don't know who you are arguing against. People who view thing negatively use descriptor for the thing as an insult. Yes that's what I've said.
Somehow I feel like both insults see their fair share of inaccurate and accurate use.
This is getting circular, so let's just agree to disagree.
That works
If its any consolation it appears the lemmy hivemind understood your reasoning lol
It seems the hivemind caught onto the multilayered irony of a self-proclaimed "hippie" (an offensive term, originally) who allegedly vikes, frothing at semantics of a derogatory term's classification rather than listening to reason and facts as presented, and repeatedly, no less. One might even, were they less classy than I, wonder whether this so-called long-haired anti-war unpatriotic xenophobe slaver was pantomiming "retarded". 🤔