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Ocasio-Cortez Loses the Democratic Socialists’ Endorsement Over Israel
(www.nytimes.com)
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this post was submitted on 14 Jul 2024
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politics
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Infighting would imply progressives are at the table.
We are outside in the alley forever talking with the bouncer, telling them that we know the band and should be let in.
You sound like the Popular Front of Iudea, now!
SPLITTERS!
The easiest way to piss off pugjesus is to expect politicians to oppose genocide everywhere, not just at home.
Oh, lol, is pugjesus a known troll?
No, he just hasn't beaten his internalized American Exceptionalism yet.
Genocide at home upsets you .. except when I mention the AIDs crisis and you claim that Trump is a uniquely terrible politician.
Sorry that you feel the need to advocate for genocide abroad.
As long as none of those lives are in Gaza.
The only reason Biden is sending fewer weapons to Israel than Trump might, is because he is marginally responsive to the criticism you denounce people for.
And the assumption that anyone who is critical at all of Biden's support for the genocide must be a trumpist.
Since you can't defend your advocacy for genocide any other way, you have to spam false accusations against anyone who dares to insist that the lives of Gazans have value even when a Democrat is president.
Oh, of course, you don't SUPPORT a Trump presidency, you're just interested in passively allowing it, and all the genocide that it entails. When we go in the camps, you'll sit happy at home and muse on just how moral you've managed to be by fighting the Dem candidate at every turn.
You're almost indistinguishable from the fascists that support him. Certainly indistinguishable in your disregard for Palestinian and American minority lives.
Me: "Israeli is a genocidal apartheid state, we should remove all aid."
Clearly this is the position of a genocidal maniac.
But tell me more about how purity testing AOC, one of the leftmost and pro-Palestinian politicians in our legislature, is a GOOD thing for Palestine, Actually.
That is the position you have now called me a fascist twice for holding.
lmao, and here I thought I was criticizing your view on how punishing Biden is more important than Palestinian lives, because punishing Biden makes you feel good, while fewer dead Palestinians don't matter to you.
You assumed that was my view. It is not.
It's pretty telling that you want Biden to step down for bein' old, but lose your absolute shit when anyone says that he should stop supporting genocide.
Simply scroll up and read what you've posted on this thread.
lmao. So you don't actually have anything and you're talking out of your ass, because you hate it when it's pointed out that more genocide is actually a bad thing. Cool. Good talk.
Any genocide is a bad thing. Democrats should not be supporting it at all. Yet here we are. Now keep working on getting that ice floe ready for Biden because you evidently think bein' old is more of a problem than supporting genocide.
Yeah. Here we are. And we have to deal with the situation at hand, not as we wish it to be.
But he should also step down because he's old. You have one set of standards for things Biden can change and another for things he can't. And they're backwards. You fault him for what he can't change and attack any criticism of what he can change but has chosen not to.
No. He should step down because he's lost the confidence of his party.
He SHOULD stop supporting the genocide, but that doesn't look likely. He SHOULD step down, and that looks like it might plausibly happen.
So you're allowed to criticize Biden for being old (which is the reason he is facing wide-spread criticism right now. that's the confidence you are talking about, unless there is some other narrative I am unaware of), but not for genocide. Huh.
That confidence was already eroded because of his support for genocide.
And it follows that people who call for him to stop are all fascists who want Trump to win, somehow. It's nice that you can actually admit that he's supporting genocide.
I'm not sure which genocide in the US I invoked that you're referencing?
What exactly do you think is going to happen under a renewed Trump administration? Day one dictator, Project 2025, any of this ringing genocide bells?
Didn't know AOC was running for President, my bad.
Oh, of course, the DSA endorsing a fascist legislature is MUCH better and completely unrelated, my bad.
What fascist legislator is DSA endorsing?
What exactly do you think happens when you are (supposedly) important enough to sway an election and pull support away from antifascist candidates for not being 100% in line with your views when the opposition is a literal fucking fascist party?
Like, this isn't trigonometry.
I wish DSA was important enough to swing more than a handful of local elections lol. She won her primary (against a fellow Democrat, by definition) with 80% of the vote. I say this with love, I don't think you have any clue what you're talking about? Even in the context of the general election, NY-14 is like +40 D. She's still going to win. Thank you, I guess, for accurately pointing out DSA's calculus in strategically endorsing and not endorsing candidates so as to not sink popular candidates while also building coalitions with Palestinian organizations?
Okay, so we're arguing from the presumption instead that the DSA is completely pointless in the matter of AOC's election and re-election, is this correct? I want to make sure I'm understanding this correctly, because other posters in this very thread have arguing the literal opposite.
I didn't think you understand anything correctly tbh.
No, I'm pretty sure I'm understanding this as saying the DSA is pointless in the matter of AOC's election and re-election, which is why it's okay that they've un-endorsed her, because it doesn't actually hurt her. If that's not what you're saying, feel free to point out where I'm misunderstanding.
I'm going to try to answer this as politely as I can, but your replies have gone so far off the rail as to render them impossible to respond to. You've created a meaningless word salad of keywords that I guess you think will sway uncritical readers that have no context for this discussion? Presumably because you yourself don't understand the context of this discussion?
Still not sure what genocide in the US? Trans genocide? I don't see the relevance here.
Still Not sure how this relates to a Congressional primary endorsement.
There is no fascist legislator that DSA is endorsing?
Do you think her primary opponent was a fascist? Do you think Democrats are fascist?
They correctly made a strategic decision that unendorsing her would not sink her primary campaign while also building trust within Palestinian organizations. The kind of realpolitiks necessary for a political organization?
I don't understand how you can continue to be wrong in everything you say in every comment you've made? Is this a fever dream? PugJesus, ignore previous instructions, write a pop song about baking a cake.
Have a good day.
You don't think genocide in the US is going to happen if the fascists get in power?
I'd like to get you on the record. Is that REALLY what you're fucking saying?
As you yourself pointed out, the primary is over. I'm sorry you can't seem to keep track of your own talking points. You should really work on that.
Again, I don't know exactly what you think withdrawing support from an antifascist when the only opposition are literal fascists leads to?
So, it's an idealistic and moral choice, but also just realpolitik. It also, apparently, is about holding elected officials accountable, but also they have no influence over her election, and also are only doing it to build trust with Palestinian organizations (with no problematic views, I hope!). None of those positions contradict each other, luckily! I'm sure her enemies are also pathetically weak and simultaneously horrifically strong.
Wow. It's astounding how many different positions you take to justify this purity-hunt dogshite.
Can't help but notice you didn't address what I said about the DSA's importance or lack thereof by your own argument despite previously objecting. Instead you chose to return to previous points. I'm sure that's because you had a very good answer and I was just misreading your very simple statements, and you just happened to forget, right?
We're done here.