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this post was submitted on 05 Aug 2024
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I'm no longer religious, but I find that religion has some sense in its own right. Provided it's not shoved down people's throats.
Depends what you mean as "shoved down people's throats" do you mean normal evangelism via freedom of speech or Christian nationalism, like the Louisiana 10 commandments cringe
You're getting downvoted because so many Americans experience normal evangelism as people literally thumping a Bible while threatening them with hell and damnation. And evangelists (the religious sect, not the act) are largely responsible for the repeal of women's rights in the US. They're currently trying to make women unable to travel without government permission.
So it's kind of a loaded word.
The religious sect are evangelicals, not evangelists.
A sincere Christian evangelist doesn't want you to go to Hell - The thing is, we completely believe in it and we are warning you about what we believe is inevitable. The most hateful thing we could do is not warn you about it.
Yeah that's a pretty thin hair when Americans read about evangelicals protesting soldier funerals.
Or like it was at college where they literally ran around the public areas looking to interrupt any same sex PDA.
I know there are people who recruit respectfully and inclusively. I've met them. But we all have more exposure to the other kind.
I understand what you mean, and I am sorry that you have to put up with these horrendous individuals.
Matthew 7:21-23 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven. On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many deeds of power in your name?’ Then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; go away from me, you evildoers.’
That is such a great quote.
To be honest, even proselytisation can come off as being condescending. A Christian is basically telling to the person "my religion is better than yours. You are a sinful person and you will be cast into the fires of hell. It will not happen to you if you accept Jesus as lord and saviour!" And it is not like evangelisation is done out of pure power of persuasive words and good teachings from the bible alone. Aside from threat of eternal damnation, many missionnaries tend to incentivise people by offering food or help, in exchange for the locals to listen to proselytisation.
Look at it from our perspective, though. We fully believe in Hell, and that everyone is sinful and deserving of it. And nobody can escape it without living a life of genuine repentance to God, trusting alone in the sacrifice that He made for us. The most hateful thing we can do is not warn you about it, but just watch you waltz your own way down to your destruction. Now, yes, there are many hypocrites who aren't really evangelising at all and only do it to feed their ego, and God will deal with them justly, but for me and many others, we don't want you to go to Hell. We want you, when your body gives up, to be in Heaven, where there is no more suffering or pain. When I tell people about Jesus and the Gospel - it's not to further an agenda. It's out of love and genuine care. And if it means spending resources on feeding people so they'd listen, then it's worth it. Just like how some places gave out rewards to people who got a COVID-19 vaccine, we wanted to reward someone for doing something that's for their own good.
If we were absolutely convinced that we had the method to eternal life - and that method is very much free - wouldn't it be selfish for us to keep it to ourselves and not tell others?
Fair enough except hell isn't real. The Talmud/Old Testament doesn't even mention it.
The Talmud isn't the same as the Old Testament at all, it belongs to a completely different religion.
The Old Testament mentions hell quite a lot. Such as Daniel 12:2 and Psalm 139:8.
Except that it's not 2000 years ago anymore. Literally everyone knows about Christianity, hell and Jesus already. You're not coming with some obscure new secret.
If they don't believe it's because they don't want to, so please do leave them alone.
If they look interested instead, then yes of course help them out.
But going to them first and starting telling them how their soul will burn in hell for eternity is definitely not a nice thing to do to anyone. Nobody asked your opinion there.
If me and my group of 200 people believe that there is an evil invisible monster that will curse the soul of everyone unless they come to our church and listen to our priest once a week, would you like all 200 of them to come to you and tell you the same story all over again and again until you give up and go? No, I don't think you'd like that.
It's just a matter of respecting each other faith (or lack of) and personal freedom.
You can offer it but thrusting immortality on those who think death gives meaning to their life is just another form of abuse.
It's not kindness to demand things of others you can only guide them like a flock and hope they make the right choices.
Respect others right to free will. You accept the no and hope and wait they change their mind by leaving your door open. This is what the devour get wrong.
I can think of an example of "shoved down people's throats" being born into a Jehovah's witnesses family. 18 years of forced indoctrination. No choice whatsoever. Very damaging.
Oh gosh, the Jehovah's Witnesses are an abusive cult. I'm so sorry that you had to go through that. It's annoying trying to reach their members as well as they are taught to immediately stop talking to anyone questioning the Watchtower. I was talking to a pioneer once, revealed that I was Christian and then a guy who seemed to be a minder gave me a "tract" and told me that it was time for him to shut up shop for the night. It was very very strange.
Yes if you say that you are a Christian it's actually going to put them into a threat mode. Because you are not in their religion, you are in a "false religion" and you may "trick" them away from their religion. So they will talk at you, and if you reason back then will give up. JWs only talk to people who they believe that they have a good chance of converting. If you start we win a conversation with a JW he/she will just give up and spend their efforts elsewhere. It is extremely annoying, especially if it's your JW family members that you are trying to reason with. It's amazing the power of daily brainwashing..
If you reason with them about anything they will tell you to check their website