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submitted 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) by MicroWave@lemmy.world to c/world@lemmy.world

One of Moscow's fighter jets has been shot down by Ukrainian forces, according to a military blogger with links to the Russian air force. Another pro-Moscow milblogger said that the Sukhoi Su-34 aircraft had been downed by a Western-supplied F-16.

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[-] s_s@lemm.ee 23 points 1 month ago

If the USAF doesn't want to deal with the A-10s supply chain, there's a good chance Ukraine doesn't either.

The only thing that keeps the A-10 flying is Congressional mandates from a few jobs-oriented congressmen.

[-] Madison420@lemmy.world 9 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

It's a morale booster. Marines want a battleship to roll-up and lob explosive vws at the enemy and the army wants to keep it's brrt buddy. With more modern electronics and better drone link they'd still be very capable at the job they are built to do.

[-] Maalus@lemmy.world 7 points 1 month ago

You don't spend excessive logistics on a "morale booster". Then, those morale boosters would get shot down in no time and it would have both the strain on the logistics, and the opposite effect for morale. It's an old plane that's not useful on modern battlefields. Get Ukraine what they need - long range rockets and permission to use them how they want. Get them more fighter jets. Get them more artillery. Don't send trash.

[-] perestroika@lemm.ee 1 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Ideally, people should try to get them Jas-39 Gripen with MBDA Meteor missiles to back up the F-16 fleet.

Currently, the situation seems to be: F-16 pilots are still inexperienced and their missiles are outranged by some missiles that a Su-35 could be carrying (e.g. R-77M with 190 km range). When a Su-34 (fighter-bomber) conducts glide bombing runs from a distance of 40 km, a Su-35 (air superiority fighter) typically provides it air cover. Under such conditions, it's a difficult task for an F-16 pilot to fire an AMRAAM at the bomber (at best 180 km range) and evade counter-fire from the fighter. Fortunately they've got shiny new ECM pods and hopefully Russian planes haven't got decent radars.

However, a plane with longer range weapons (Meteor can fly for 200 km) would deter even a fighter escort of the Su-34, and likely end glide bombing as a tactic.

Alternatively, one can hope that the actual range of AMRAAM exceeds the advertised range or the actual range of R-77M falls short of advertised range - or that they have better radars, or can somehow backport Meteor to F-16, or that their ECM can beat the electronics of R-77. However, as far as I'm aware, firing an AMRAAM from maximum range needs a really big target (actual bomber, not a fighter-bomber).

Either way, good to hear it happened. :) If it happens more, it might finally deter glide bombing. So far, air defense ambushes have also temporarily deterred it and drones have struck airfields where the Su-34 planes get equipped, but nothing has stopped it for long.

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this post was submitted on 13 Oct 2024
310 points (97.3% liked)

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