Team Trump Is Gaming Out How to Ship U.S. Citizens to El Salvador | Trump officials are talking internally about denaturalizing American citizens — and potentially sending some to El Salvador (www.rollingstone.com)

submitted 2 months ago by silence7@slrpnk.net to c/politics@lemmy.world

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[-] FirstCircle@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 months ago

“And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand?... The Organs would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers and transport and, notwithstanding all of Stalin's thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt! If...if...We didn't love freedom enough. And even more – we had no awareness of the real situation.... We purely and simply deserved everything that happened afterward.”

Aleksandr I. Solzhenitsyn , The Gulag Archipelago 1918–1956

[-] smayonak@lemmy.world 0 points 2 months ago

Jordan Peterson constantly quotes Solzhenitsyn warning of what the Liberal party would do to canada or the democrats would do to the usa. He would then promote a tool like polievre or an overt fascist orangeman without any irony at all. Today he seems to be confused about what fascism is and has oftentimes waffles between endorsing them or trying to avoid discussing them, like a true intellectual coward who was wrong about everything he ever said

[-] porous_grey_matter@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 months ago

He's not confused about what fascism is, he knows and he wants it. Just like any fascist, you can't take what he says at face value, it's all trolling games like the Sartre quote.

[-] Mohamed@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 months ago

That's it exactly. JBP, JD Vance, etc., play word games of rhetoric to get what they want. It's like they are defence lawyers and morality is a legal system they are trying to game - they argue whatever just to win.

[-] andros_rex@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

With Peterson, he did make himself sick with that “carnivore” diet. He’s been huffing his own fumes so long that I think it’s fucked with his cognitive abilities.

I’ve listened to his class lectures - I do not understand how he earned a doctorate, and I do not understand why anyone taken the shit that comes out of his mouth seriously. It’s just misinterpreted Jung with some Manichean/Christian influence.

[-] smayonak@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

No he got sick from having a paradoxical reaction to benzos and then trying to quit them by going into a medically induced coma in Russia where I GUARANTEE YOU the fsb undoubtedly took blackmail video of him cheating on his wife. His wife had terminal kidney cancer but then miraculously recovered as well while on the carnivore diet so I doubt it is all that harmful.

[-] No1@aussie.zone 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

I heard Peterson described as Joe Rogan with an education and vocabulary, who occasionally has a cry lol

[-] porous_grey_matter@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 months ago

For sure, he wasn't the smartest to begin with and he's gone downhill. Even so, he's not so dumb that he doesn't know what he wants is to subjugate women and non-whites, and he will say whatever he thinks will make that happen regardless of whether he believes it or it even sounds plausible.

[-] Treczoks@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

Germany 1933-45. Right out of the book.

[-] _g_be@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

Isn't those the numbers on the hats?

[-] Bloomcole@lemm.ee 0 points 2 months ago

Plenty of European countries try to do this also

[-] theherk@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

Which ones?

[-] Bloomcole@lemm.ee -1 points 2 months ago

https://news.err.ee/1609440314/uk-other-european-countries-may-outsource-prisoners-to-estonia

[-] OmegaMan@lemmings.world 2 points 2 months ago

I don't see anywhere in here about stripping people of citizenship.

[-] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 0 points 2 months ago

Germany is deporting EU citizens from Germany illegally for protesting against the genocide.

[-] Bloomcole@lemm.ee 0 points 2 months ago

So?

[-] OmegaMan@lemmings.world 2 points 2 months ago

So that's the Nazi comparison part.

[-] Bloomcole@lemm.ee 0 points 2 months ago

Nothing says they wont be stripping people of citizenship.
I know EU countries, including my own have been doing that for decades.

But I think shipping them off to an even horrible jail is the worse part here.

[-] Bloomcole@lemm.ee -1 points 2 months ago

And don't forget Genocide/kids in cages Joe, the humanitarian.

[-] Hikuro93@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

If there was an honest to God legal way they'd already have figured it out along with everything else in Project 2025, long before coming into office.

They're trying to find out a better loophole than the last one, which blew up in their face. And trying to find ways to remove the people in the way of said loopholes.

[-] RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 4 points 2 months ago

They don’t plan.

Planning would entail following the law, customs, and procedures.

If they just steamroll everyone with bullshit and make it up as they go then everyone else is scrambling to sort out wtf they are doing and figure out what rules were broken.

[-] tracker@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 months ago

I think they should do that to any US Citizen with 34 convictions or more… starting with the orange ones!

[-] m4xie@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 months ago

Call it rule 34

[-] tracker@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 months ago

Yes, Google that, it explains everything!

[-] TheReturnOfPEB@reddthat.com 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Trump says that the future of a man resident in the US, Kilmar Abrego Garcia, is not up to the US.

https://lawandcrime.com/high-profile/these-barbarians-are-now-in-the-sole-custody-of-el-salvador-trump-official-insists-dad-deported-in-error-is-alive-and-secure-but-potus-says-his-future-not-up-to-us/

Trump also says that the future of Greenland is not up to Greenland but up to US.

What the fuck -- how can the US demand an actual country from a country and not a resident from a country ?

[-] blakenong@lemmings.world 1 points 2 months ago

Buy a gun and fight for your life or you’ll die in prison.

[-] silence7@slrpnk.net 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

If it comes down to that, we've already lost.

Right now, I'd advise people to do as much outreach as possible to people you know. If you're on commercial social media, post a screenshot, put the link in a comment. Send a DM. Put up stickers.

Building the level of support that would be necessary to win a revolution likely makes nonviolent paths such as impeachment possible.

The guns are to prevent violent suppression of that public support. Not as a first choice.

[-] Bloomcole@lemm.ee 1 points 2 months ago

Put up stickers

Fuckin Americans LOL.

[-] barneypiccolo@lemm.ee 1 points 2 months ago

When the best places to spread the message of Resistance, like Reddit, have decided to actively comply and collude with the Nazis, we have to rely on other means to spread the message and give hope to those who think they are alone. Seeing stickers on poles and walls and bumpers as the go through their day, lets them know that there are others out there who are of the same mind.

Its not the only weapon, obviously, nobody expects the war to be won with stickers alone, but it's one piece of the puzzle that has a real effect. Propaganda is powerful, which is why the Reoublicans actively built the Conservative Propaganda Machine, which now fully controls the political messaging in America, as the Dems stood by, smugly scoffing, and totally neglecting their chance to answer it. Now they are 30 years behind in that game, and still haven't even started to conceptualize a strategy to confront it.

[-] Bloomcole@lemm.ee 1 points 2 months ago

Reddit, like any and all media media, has been controlled by your regime since 2016 when it grew exponentially and became too important.
https://www.mintpressnews.com/jessica-ashooh-reddit-national-security-state-plant/277639/

[-] CosmicTurtle0@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 months ago

"Those who make peaceful reform impossible will make violent revolution inevitable."

[-] Jhex@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

If it comes down to that

another move of the goal post

[-] Soup@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

“We’ve tried nothing and…”

I’m not exactly the most active person. Not been to protests here in Canada but I do vote and all that. But ya know what I don’t do? I don’t actively discourage people from protecting themselves.

You have already lost. The question is whether or not you’re willing to fight back and win in round two.

[-] blakenong@lemmings.world 1 points 2 months ago

Centrists like you got us here. Status quos. Call your rep. Go chant in a circle and pray for a better life.

See where that got us? Don’t like being shot at? Don’t be a cunt.

[-] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 0 points 2 months ago

The guns are to prevent violent suppression of that public support.

That's one part of it, but also people should be defending themselves and their communities from ICE and one way to do that is guns. When an ICE agent is arresting your neighbor the correct option isn't to preach nonviolence, but to pull the damn trigger.

[-] silence7@slrpnk.net 0 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

That's remarkably hard to do in any kind of reliable way. ICE snatches are fast, and the odds of being there with a gun and recognizing what's going on are low. The odds of shooting somebody by mistake are high.

To date things like handing out red cards has been far more effective

[-] electric_nan@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 months ago

ICE agents exist outside of ongoing raids. They sleep in beds and shop in stores.

[-] silence7@slrpnk.net 0 points 2 months ago

In practice, what I've seen people do is to use large crowds. I haven't yet seen any overt use of guns for that kind of defense.

[-] LeninOnAPrayer@lemm.ee 2 points 2 months ago

This is great when it works and you have the numbers. But long term that is not a solution and not a solution all the time. A gun is a solution at all times. Get one before they don't let you.

If they are coming for you it's not a "misunderstanding". You wont be able to talk your way out of it by being nice and doing what they say. They are Nazis. They are taking you to a death camp.

They don't care if you're a citizen. They didn't care when it was a green card.

Stay in your home and defend it. Coordinate with your neighbors. Have one of them to call to bring additional resistance and pressure. But have a gun. Because when they break down your door. That's it.

Organizing with your community to protect each other is the best thing you can do. And part of that is making sure you are all prepared and armed.

[-] peoplebeproblems@midwest.social 2 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Large crowds are awesome because if you kill one person in the crowd

The murderer is judged by a jury of his peers and sentenced then and there.

[-] Nougat@fedia.io 1 points 2 months ago

Let's be honest. If they come for you, you're going. Still, take someone with you on the way out.

[-] errer@lemmy.world 0 points 2 months ago

I just don’t feel comfortable bringing a gun into my house. I don’t think I stand a chance against 10 automatic-wielding ICE agents.

[-] blakenong@lemmings.world 3 points 2 months ago

You don’t. You’re supposed to kill as many as you can before they take you out. You’re dead either way.

[-] Necroscope0@lemm.ee 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Don't have to get them all by yourself. If everyone they try to arrest gets just one of them they will run out of men a lot faster than they will arrest everyone they want to get rid of. There are way way way way more of us than there are of them if we would get off our asses and stand up for each other and ourselves.

[-] Anomalocaris@lemm.ee 0 points 2 months ago

that will just give them an excuse to murder you immediately, and then the right to murder anyone immediately.

although I'm not sure what else can be done, without saying anything illegal that might get me in an FBI watchlist and give me expedited tickets to a free vacation in el Salvador

[-] errer@lemmy.world -1 points 2 months ago

I’m just incredulous that anyone here believes they have a chance against a militarized police and immigration force. Feels very much like when the right pretended they could defend themselves against the government “taking their guns.” 99% of civilians, gun owners or not, have no chance.

[-] AngryCommieKender@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

The point isn't to take out all of ICE. The point is that if they come for you, you are already dead. Your body just hasn't stopped moving yet. Cops have shit aiming skills. If you open your door with a Molotov Cocktail and a shotgun, you are taking the quick death, and giving the ones you don't kill and maim a real and present danger for every single time they follow illegal orders. If you just go peacefully, you're the only one that is gonna die, and you are going to die as a slave in an El Salvadorian prison.

[-] arrow74@lemm.ee 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

The goal is not to take out the entirety of ICE yourself. The goal is if they come for you to go down fighting and hope to take at least one. The only other option is to go peacefully and be shipped to an El Salvadorian gulag. Where you'll probably die anyway.

Better to die trying imo

this post was submitted on 12 Apr 2025

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