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Meta being fined $100k a day for personalized ads in Norway (techcrunch.com)

submitted 1 year ago by SELECTstarFROMreddit@sh.itjust.works to c/technology@lemmy.world

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[-] fiat_lux@kbin.social 190 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

From the linked techcrunch article:

will face fines of up to one million NOK (~$100k) per day.
unless it obtains users’ consent to the processing

From the order itself:

The order applies from 4 August 2023
we may decide to impose a coercive fine of up to NOK 1 000 000 (one million) per day

Misleading title.

[-] Burstar@lemmy.dbzer0.com 84 points 1 year ago

unless it obtains users’ consent to the processing

"Do you consent to the processing?"

'No, I do not consent'

[Account Suspended]

"Wait, I CONSENT! Please, take all my data! Take all the data of my entire family and everyone I've ever associated with online! ANYTHING but suspend the account. PLEASE!"

'Thank you for your patronage.'

[-] LouNeko@lemmy.world 20 points 1 year ago

It's going to be closer to an E-mail saying "We are informing you that we have updated our privacy policy." which nobody is going to read. And the change is going to be an added line of "With continuation of usage of our products and services in the Norway region you give meta the right to collect and processes your information for marketing purposes.". Which also nobody is going to read. Voila, plausible consent.

[-] evatronic@lemm.ee 16 points 1 year ago

For what it's worth, a lot of countries with decent privacy laws are looking at closing that stupid loophole by requiring "affirmative consent" whenever something changes to the detriment of the consumer (i.e., more data, wider scope, etc.), meaning the companies would have to require the user to take some action to affirm they consent.

Those same proposals also have provisions prohibiting account suspension / blocking for not consenting. I.e., you can say "no" and continue to use the service exactly as before, though, newer features may be blocked.

[-] LouNeko@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago

Its going to be the same devious bull that all the websites are pulling with accepting cookies. You could either press "no" on every single page all the time or press "yes" once and be done with it. Most people in their 20s and 30s are trained on years of finding the real play or download button on shady streaming websites and we still struggle. I can't imagine how older, less tech savy folk are doing or kids with the attention span equal to the lifetime of a 10w lamp hooked to a nuclear reactor. (I'm not trying to talk anybody down, just using a hyperbolic statement)

As long "explicit opt-in" isn't the standard, it's going to be a struggle. I should go out of my way to give them my data and not make sure that they don't just take it.

I would just love to see a political party answering the corporate statement "But we can't make money if we don't sell ads" with "Should have been a real business then, well, sucks to be you.".

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[-] mintiefresh@lemmy.world 61 points 1 year ago

Fine should be larger. And more countries should join in.

Thank you for coming to my ted talk.

[-] GatoB@lemmy.world 18 points 1 year ago

Just getting a fine and making huge benefits so it is "worth" to keep doing? It should be banned because it keeps doing ilegal actions but since they have money they can do whatever they want

[-] Minzert@lemmy.fmhy.ml 5 points 1 year ago

Do they really make a hundred grand a day in Norway though? It's not a big country.

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[-] prole@sh.itjust.works 55 points 1 year ago

$100k is nothing to these people. It's like your or I paying $0.25 a day. They see it as the cost of doing business.

[-] nyctre@lemmy.fmhy.ml 29 points 1 year ago

Norway has a population of 5-6 mil. I don't think there's enough of them to generate 100k/day, is there? Or maybe that's worth it, what do I know? They're not gonna get fined that much anyway

[-] matlag@sh.itjust.works 6 points 1 year ago

Based on https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/120114/how-does-facebook-fb-make-money.asp 39$/user/year for Facebook & Messenger alone. In a country of 5-6M people, let's say 5.5M, with 70% of the population being users ( from: https://www.statista.com/statistics/584917/facebook-users-in-norway-by-age-group/ ), that gives ~3.85M users * 39$ = 150.15M$/year, 12.5M$/month, or 417k$/day. Norway is a rich country, so one should assume a Norway user's revenue is higher than the 39$ average.

So, 100k$/day is certainly a decent figure for Norway's operations, meaning a local Facebook senior manager must be in panic right now. But Would that local senior manager have any power to change anything given Norway is such a small market but yielding would set a precedent for all other EU members? That's what is at stake!

[-] Morphit@feddit.uk 4 points 1 year ago

Is there a /c/theydidthemath anywhere? Good work.

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[-] MentalEdge@sopuli.xyz 15 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

It should be a number "per user" "per day" not just a "per day". Make it really hurt based on how much it's being done.

[-] bighi@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Or just make a cost per day that is punitive.

If I did something outright evil and criminal, and my only punishment was a $0.25 fine, I would feel motivated to keep doing it again.

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[-] Sabata11792@kbin.social 6 points 1 year ago

Let's just double the amount of ads in Norway to cover the loss.

[-] Demdaru@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

I mean, any money flowing from them to nation is good at the end of the day.

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[-] jaschen@lemmy.world 29 points 1 year ago

100k? That's not even a rounding error for them.

[-] Gustephan@lemmy.world 26 points 1 year ago

100k/day (36.5 million anually) is ~0.03% of Meta's 2022 profits (121 billion). That's not a fine, it's barely even a tax. If you make 50k/year profit and the government gave you a similar fine, they'd be taking $15 from you. That sounds more like bribe money for Norwegian politicians than a good faith attempt to protect their citizens.

[-] mob@lemmy.world 11 points 1 year ago

I have a hard time believe they profited 121 billion dollars, when their 2022 gross revenue was 116 billion

I'm sure it's still a ridiculous amount of profit but that number seemed way to big at first glance so I had to check

[-] Gustephan@lemmy.world 14 points 1 year ago

I admittedly didn't look too hard for that 121bil figure, your source seems much better than the "Google it and grab the first number I see" approach I used. I see 91.36B gross profit for 2022 in your source. That makes the 36,500,000 fine ~0.04% of their profits instead or the 0.03% I got at first, equivalent to a $20 fine on 50k profit. I think the rest of what I said is still valid with the new numbers. Thanks for keeping me honest!

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[-] asunaspersonalasst@lemmy.world 25 points 1 year ago

Should have been "per user per day"

[-] Doodoocaca@lemmy.world 23 points 1 year ago

100k a day is not even worth looking at for them.

[-] Kes@lemmy.blahaj.zone 17 points 1 year ago

100k a day for operating in a country of 5 million people. The question isn't "how much does this affect their global earnings?", it's "is it worth paying 100k a day to run personalized ads in a country with a population of Minnesota?"

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[-] Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de 12 points 1 year ago

which is presumably according to plan for norway, they get an easy source of extra income.

[-] Doodoocaca@lemmy.world 15 points 1 year ago

Maybe but 100k a day is not noteworthy for a country like Norway either.

[-] boonhet@lemm.ee 16 points 1 year ago

It's not, but 36.5 mill a year, if spent on one or two projects that aren't otherwise receiving much funding, can still make a significant change in something.

[-] Facebook@lemmy.world 20 points 1 year ago

There's Norway we're paying that, ha ha. More zingers like that over on Threads!

[-] moitoi@lemmy.world 16 points 1 year ago

It's still better than nothing. I guess it's the beginning.

[-] Synthead@lemmy.world 14 points 1 year ago

That'll show them, right?

[-] Soad@lemmy.world 14 points 1 year ago

It should be 100k per user per day. Otherwise it's just a rounding error for them. I can also garantee that no user on Facebook is generating 100k in ad revenue in a single day. Let alone that much in a year.

[-] Transcendant@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

Came to say the same, this is just a cost of doing business for Meta.

[-] transientDCer@lemmy.world 13 points 1 year ago

How many people do you guys know who have Signal installed who also use Facebook / Insta? Feel like these are separate circles in a venn diagram.

[-] Shayreelz@sh.itjust.works 7 points 1 year ago

Most of the family members I've gotten to use signal still use FB and insta

[-] kklusz@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago

That’s me. I’m not abandoning friends who are solely reachable on FB/Insta, but I’ll also talk on signal when possible

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[-] Skanky@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago

So, what exactly happens if Facebook just says "no" to paying the fine?

[-] raltoid@lemmy.world 20 points 1 year ago

In most places companies become blocked from operating in the country, and any potential assets in the country will be taken as compensation.

There might also be a lawsuit in the companies main country of operation.

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[-] hup@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

That's like fining a person 0.01 per day for speeding. The company sees it as a limited time only discount and invitation to do it a TON right now and get people accustomed to it, before the people who don't like it start complaining louder. From Facebooks perspective its a black Friday sale on Norwegian data.

[-] FUBAR@lemmy.world 10 points 1 year ago

So it’s essentially a fee

[-] joel_feila@lemmy.world 10 points 1 year ago

Fines shpuld be based a percent of income. A multi billion company lole meta wont care about this tiny fine

[-] darkdemize@sh.itjust.works 9 points 1 year ago

That's peanuts for a company that size. That's the cost of doing business.

[-] MidwestMayonaiseSalad@lemmy.world 28 points 1 year ago

Facebook somehow makes about $18 per person on the planet in ad revenue.

Norway is 5 million people or $90 million/year all else being equal.

$100k/day is $36.5 million/year.

So, it’s less than it should be by probably a factor of 4-5, but still not so small they won’t feel it

[-] _Tom_@lemmy.world 29 points 1 year ago

That's why if a fine does not exceed the benefit the company gained from it, it's not a deterrent but a cost of business.

[-] 8bitguy@kbin.social 3 points 1 year ago

The way I read it, the fine is capped to $1M NOK.

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[-] Jakdracula@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago

So, about .000000001 of what they make a day?

[-] sethboy66@kbin.social 4 points 1 year ago

They make $10,000,000,000,000 a day? Must be a hell of a business model.

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[-] FIST_FILLET@kbin.social 4 points 1 year ago

chump change for the zuck, but still way better than nothing! good job norway

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this post was submitted on 17 Jul 2023

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