TIL About the Jeju Massacre, where South Korean forces wiped out 10 percent of the island of Jeju for the crime of organizing a General Strike : todayilearned

[-] cnlwhs@lemmy.blahaj.zone 20 points 2 months ago

It's called 4.3 in here South Korea. Fascist pesident Syngman Lee, backed by the US army, committed genocide in Jeju. The army was ordered to consider anyone in the island, including children, as riots. The reason of this genocide was that Labor Party of South Korea was popular in Jeju. The fascist leading opposition People's Power still claim that it was a communist riot.

[-] cnlwhs@lemmy.blahaj.zone 13 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Han Kang's novel well describes this event.

[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 10 points 2 months ago

I also recommend Han Kang's Human Acts, going over the Gwang-Ju Massacre by the butcher Chun Do-Hwan.

[-] ayyy@sh.itjust.works 6 points 2 months ago

Nobel prize recipient

Why even bother mentioning this? Nobody cares about the opinions of some crusty old imperialist fuckheads. They are clearly deeply unserious in their prize selection process.

[-] cnlwhs@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 points 2 months ago

You're right... edited

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[-] prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Yeah but I was told that it's hateful to call a fascist a fascist, so...

Guess we'll just have to live with the coming bloodshed.

[-] Flax_vert@feddit.uk 15 points 2 months ago

I am being deprogrammed....

[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 5 points 2 months ago

Nodutdol just released a toolkit on Korean reunification, going over the background of the division, its history of Japanese colonialism, and demystifying the DPRK. Seems to do a good job of going over the western framing of Korea from a Korean leftist perspective.

[-] mistermodal@lemmy.ml 15 points 2 months ago

The RoK put communists in concentration camps and it is ignored as often as those who died in Hitler's camps

[-] besmtt@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago

https://youtu.be/bvk75wsyUbQ

[+] sun_is_ra@sh.itjust.works -22 points 2 months ago

Title very misleading

A general strike was later organized by the Workers' Party of South Korea (WPSK) from February to March 1948.

Yes but then

The WPSK launched an insurgency in April 1948, attacking police and Northwest Youth League members stationed on Jeju who had been mobilized to suppress the protests by force.[

Not justifying a crime like this, just setting the record straight

[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 27 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Yes, because the dictator Rhee Syngman was slaughtering communists and labor organizers, as well as just random civilians.

[+] 1rre@discuss.tchncs.de -14 points 2 months ago

[removed by mod]

[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 25 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Are you really coming to the defense of the dictator Rhee Syngman just because leftists hate him? The WPSK started fighting against the dictatorship because it was a merciless dictatorship slaughtering communists, trade unionists, etc. Rhee Syngman was a butcher, he slaughtered countless Koreans even below the parallel. One of the more famous instances was blowing up the Hangang bridge while civilians were still on it, just to save his own skin.

You're outright defending Korean Pinochet.

[+] 1rre@discuss.tchncs.de -17 points 2 months ago

I'm not defending anyone, I'm saying that it's unsurprising that the title is a part-truth given the instance.

It's also unsurprising that you get attacked for pointing out that the victims weren't entirely innocent: a general strike and a revolution are not the same, regardless of the cause, because the full, accurate, truth is discouraged here even when it paints the same picture you were originally trying to.

[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 19 points 2 months ago

You're complaining about the lack of justification for Rhee Syngman's butchery of Jeju Island in the post title. The victims were largely innocent, the fact that some villiages in Jeju took up arms against Rhee Syngman's dictatorship was used as justification by Rhee Syngman to slaughter 10% of Jeju Island. It's said that the bloodbath was so significant that the waters around Jeju ran red. This is on top of the fact that armed resistance was fully justified, and intensified after Rhee Syngman started slaughtering innocent villagers.

Truth isn't discouraged here, what's discouraged is caping for fascist dictators by trying to say the slaughter was justified. You had a knee-jerk reaction because leftists correctly pointed out an example of the ROK's dictatorship slaughtering civilians, something it did on countless occasions in its early years and continued even decades later such as the Gwang-Ju Massacre.

[+] 1rre@discuss.tchncs.de -11 points 2 months ago

You realise you're not helping your image by attacking viewpoints I don't even hold, right?

I responded to a comment asking why the post asking why details were omitted when the truth was on your side anyway, and you instantly take that as an attack on your beliefs, because posting the full truth or in any way acknowledging shortcomings of your comrades is actively discouraged, as you're very kindly demonstrating for me.

For full clarity, the actions of the old RoK government were inexcusable. The actions of the protesters were excusable given the context, but that doesn't mean they didn't happen or that we can call them something they weren't.

[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 16 points 2 months ago

The headline also omits that Rhee Syngman was a puppet placed by the US Empire specifically to slaughter communists and labor organizers after the US Empire outlawed the PRK and divided Korea. It's a headline, not a comprehensive overview, and you complained about it not including that there was armed resistance against fascism, using that as a springboard to complain about leftists. What purpose does this serve, if not to cape for Rhee Syngman?

[+] 1rre@discuss.tchncs.de -12 points 2 months ago

"for the crime of organising a general strike"

It wasn't for the general strike, it was following violence against the regime who tried to suppress the general strike.

Once again, the violence was completely excusable given the circumstances, but to say that the regime's actions were even mostly due to a simple general strike is incredibly disingenuous.

I'm not looking to villify the workers, I'm saying that tankies have a long history of hiding parts of the truth that show any form of wrongdoing by leftists, even when that wrongdoing was excusable or necessary, and that doing that is worse for your image than accepting history as it happens.

[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 12 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

The actions of the fascists were against normal labor organizers, the violent resistance largely came after. The ROK millitary was told to slaughter indiscriminately, which they did. The title is accurate, they were slaughtered for the general strike, which then errupted into armed fighting and resistance at scale. It isn't disingenuous nor is it without precedent, Rhee Syngman had sent his fascist thugs after all manner of labor organizers using "sympathies with the north" as justification all of Korea. The goal was to root out any left opposition, that was the cause.

Further, no, leftists do not have a history of hiding "necessary wrongdoing." If it's necessary, it isn't wrongdoing! The right of armed resistance to oppression is a necessity, and it doesn't mean said violence is wrong. I think it's odd to try to lecture leftists on our "image" when all you've really done is cape for Rhee Syngman and attack leftists for not having a comprehensive overview in headlines of posts.

[+] 1rre@discuss.tchncs.de -8 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Taken directly from the linked article:

A general strike was later organized by the Workers' Party of South Korea (WPSK) from February to March 1948. The WPSK launched an insurgency in April 1948, attacking police and Northwest Youth League members stationed on Jeju who had been mobilized to suppress the protests by force.[1]: 166–167 [6] The First Republic of Korea under President Syngman Rhee escalated the suppression of the uprising from August 1948, declaring martial law in November and beginning an "eradication campaign" against rebel forces in the rural areas of Jeju in March 1949, defeating them within two months. This resulting campaign has led to the event being called the Jeju massacre.

The escalation by the government came in August, after the insurgency had been launched, and I don't think it's up for debate that after this point the government forces were slaughtering indiscriminately.

Thanks once again for proving my point that you're being disingenuous, in this case by incorrectly representing the timeline, when once again the facts are on your side and you don't need to make an unjustified slaughter of a country's own people look any less justified.

I haven't once defended Rhee Syngman, all I've done is say you make yourselves look untrustworthy and suspicious by misrepresenting the truth, even when you don't need to.

[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 11 points 2 months ago

It isn't up for debate that Rhee Syngman was slaughtering labor organizers and communists before the WPSK and other groups started resisting the fascists. Further, again, Rhee Syngman was killing labor organizers that didn't resist as well, and before slaughtering Jeju. The slaughter existed because of labor organizing, not because of resistance. I'm not incorrectly representing the timeline, you're misrepresenting it by taking Rhee Syngman's narrative of just responding to the leftists, when in fact the resistance was provoked by Rhee Syngman slaughtering people.

You've defended Rhee Syngman by taking his version of events, ie no violence, then leftists resist, then he responds, rather than Rhee Sybgman slaughters people all over Korea, parties organize and resist, then Rhee Syngman ramps up the slaughter. You then used this as an opportunity to attack leftists! The one making themselves less trustworthy here is you.

[+] 1rre@discuss.tchncs.de -9 points 2 months ago

I agree that authoritarian governments' versions of events usually vary from misleading to downright false, but I used a direct quotation from the article linked in the post, so if you have issues with the veracity then take it up with the post author or Wikipedia editors.

I haven't disputed the indiscriminate slaughter post-insurgency, or that there were some instances of it before the insurgency, it's just that it wasn't a direct causation, and if you have time in the title to specify cause and effect, then you should do the most direct cause and most direct effect, not the one which makes your favoured group look the most innocent.

[-] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 10 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Addressing this first, all states are authoritarian, the difference between them lies in their class character, ie are they working class states, or capitalist states. All states are instruments of class oppression, solidifying the power of one class over the others, and in the ROK that class was the capitalist class, especially the former compradors that benefited from Japanese colonization of Korea.

Going forward, even without armed resistance, Rhee Syngman was still slaughtering labor organizers. The cause was the labor organizing, not the resistance to him. He was hand-picked by the US Empire specifically to be used as a tool to wipe out any semblance of a Korean left south of the parallel. You're putting too much of an emphasis on the resistance, and not on the root cause: leftist organizing in general was unacceptable to the US Empire and the comrador regime they installed.

The fact of the matter is that daring to organize is what caused the massacre. The headline doesn't have the full context, not even the full Wikipedia article does. I suggest you stop caping for Rhee Syngman and instead try to look at the root cause, which the OP does get closer to than what you're saying.

[-] cnlwhs@lemmy.blahaj.zone 10 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

I won a debate against evil Marxist-Leninists by pointing out how their post titles are inaccurate in the order of fascist genocide! I'm so proud of myself!

[-] cnlwhs@lemmy.blahaj.zone 9 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Do you really expect OP to explain the full context in title which would take up a full page?

[-] prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone 18 points 2 months ago

I still see no issue with the title. The troops were sent in to suppress the strike with force. Whether or not the fascists in charge tried to spin it as the strikers getting violent isn't really relevant.

[-] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 14 points 2 months ago

Mods should indeed consider banning you from the server for spreading disinfo. They are far too lenient.

[-] cnlwhs@lemmy.blahaj.zone 11 points 2 months ago

Damn... everyone in S.Korea except the far right hates Rhee... including liberals... We actually learn at school that Rhee was a dictator.

Today I learned